Speaker 0 00:00:00 Hey you. Yeah, you, if you or someone you know, is struggling with anything mentioned on today's program, please, please, please, please, please, please email
[email protected]. That's a U T H E N I C K. The
[email protected]. I am available 24 seven three 65 to help in any way that I can. I have resources. I have open ears and open heart and tons of hope. I've been freely given all these things and would love to give them to you. Be good to yourselves and each other. Follow me on Twitter, using the handle at authen, Nick and my dog, Marla on Instagram at DJ Marla dot Jean. Before we get started today, I would like to tell you that suicide is mentioned multiple times. In this episode, if you or someone you know is going to be triggered by that, or you're struggling with suicidal ideation or you have a plan to commit suicide, please reach out, speak with a counselor today at the national suicide prevention lifeline, their number is +1 800-273-8255. That's +1 800-273-8255. Alcoholics anonymous or AA will also be mentioned multiple times during this episode, the expressed views and opinions by the interviewee do not reflect AA as a whole please. In jaw. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:01:37 Mama, mama, mama, mama, mama, mama, mama, mama, mama, mama, mama, man. <inaudible>.
Speaker 0 00:02:10 Is there any sort of impression you want me to do when, when I start the show? Um, like when I do the welcome, like anybody famous, John Robinson arrow, Robert DeNiro. Fuck. Okay. Um, <inaudible> all right, here we go. My name is here, Nicholas cheer. I mean, it means Randy navel, but most people don't know. Call me Nick. I'm not Peter Griffin and this is my show. Like authentic. No, you take out the tick. And yet Nick with me as always is my dog Marla.
Speaker 1 00:03:00 Okay.
Speaker 0 00:03:05 Where we only paint nails pink, white and Brown. This is Naomi speaking. How may I help you? All right, Marla, we're not at work right now. Anyway, here on authentic, where we get authentic, we talk about all things recovery. Well, what do I mean by that? All things recovery. Well, what I mean by that is if you are still living and breathing on this earth, you yes.
Speaker 0 00:03:30 Recovery from something. As for myself, I am in recovery from alcoholism. Hi, my name is Nick and I am an alcoholic. I'm also a drug addict. I'm a compulsive gambler. I have an eating disorder. I have bipolar disorder. Really? The list could go on and on and on and on and on. Luckily for you, the show is not about me. It is however about two people. First is my guest. Jared second is about the one person that Jared is going to help by hearing his story tonight, to give them hope. Because we want to tell you that you are not alone. We are here to smash stigma. We are here to bring to light things that aren't necessarily talked about every day. We are here to help one person. So without Fitbit, Jack, welcome to the show, please, sir, introduce yourself in any way you see fit.
Speaker 2 00:04:24 My name is Jared. As, uh, Nick said, I am here. I am another person into recovery. I'm excited to be interviewed today. Thank you for having me here.
Speaker 0 00:04:32 Very welcome. You got a real nice beard going on. I've been working on it for quite some time there for so long. How long you've been growing? It's been three months. Oh man. Three months of ginger snap. Goodness. Jared's got beautiful red hair flowing. Like wow.
Speaker 2 00:04:49 I, I, I comb it over when I get out of the shower.
Speaker 0 00:04:52 Nice. Well, your facial hair flows like the rivers of Babylon. I hope you know that. I've
Speaker 2 00:04:57 Never seen the rivers of Babylon.
Speaker 0 00:05:00 It's in the fertile Crescent. I think
Speaker 2 00:05:04 You're probably right. I
Speaker 0 00:05:05 Know. I'm right. Anyway, what are you in recovery?
Speaker 2 00:05:09 Uh, alcoholism. I do like my drugs, but I first and foremost consider myself an alcoholic.
Speaker 0 00:05:16 And what is your drink of choice?
Speaker 2 00:05:18 Yes. Uh, at the end of it, it was tequila. What
Speaker 0 00:05:22 Do you mean by the end of it? It was tequila
Speaker 2 00:05:24 At the end of my drinking. It was, uh, drinking tequila daily. I say it like that because at different points in my drinking days, there was times where it was a case of beer. It was times where I would drink strict FATCA vodka. I had about a year stretch there where I drank Jack Daniels. So at the end of it, I was drinking tequila every day.
Speaker 0 00:05:45 It just so happened that you landed on tequila, landed on tequila. There's no really rhyme or reason behind it. It just was tequila at the end tequila at the end. All right, that's the end. Let's start from the, I like to ask my guests about their childhood, trying to get a feel of where you came from. What was your childhood like?
Speaker 2 00:06:05 What was my childhood like? That's a, that's a great question. So
Speaker 0 00:06:09 I only asked great questions on this
Speaker 2 00:06:11 Show. Right? I grew up in the foster system. I was given up when I was about 18 months old. And when I say foster care system, I don't mean that I went from house to house. I ran it in one single foster home and up until I was six, I was in foster care and I was adopted. I had anywhere from five to 13 brothers and sisters, siblings living in the house at all times. And by the time I was 13, I think there was 11 of us who had been adopted at that point to one single mother. So that's the best way that I can describe my childhood in his short away as possible.
Speaker 0 00:06:49 Well, you don't have to make it as short and sweet as possible. It's it's totally okay.
Speaker 2 00:06:53 Um, alright. I come from a family of six that I have, uh, blood related. Two of them are my oldest brothers and I hadn't met them until I was an adult. But growing up, I didn't really know my blood family. I knew they were out there, but I did not know there. I did not know them personally growing up. I just remember feeling out of place, feeling kind of lost, uh, wondering, wondering why I was given up for adoption. I'm wondering why that my parents weren't there to raise me. I mean, I looked around and I had brothers and sisters who were living with their brothers and sisters, if that makes sense. So in my family of adopted siblings, five of them are directly related. I have a brother from India, actually. He was brought over here when he was a baby. I have another few siblings that are brothers as well. And out of this whole group of, you know, family members that had other family members that they went with, I was split up from my other Florida related brothers and sisters, my older brother and younger sister was, uh, they ended up being adopted by my grandpa.
Speaker 0 00:08:03 You grew up in the foster system. And you said that you always felt alone because you were adopted and you weren't with your blood family. Correct. When did you find out or when did you come to the realization that you were?
Speaker 2 00:08:18 Um, I knew that the whole time growing up,
Speaker 0 00:08:21 What do you mean by that? The whole time growing up? Like when you were the first time you could make memories or?
Speaker 2 00:08:25 Well, the first time I could make memories. So I knew that I knew that I, I was in foster care. I mean, I still remember my adoption party, um, which was when I was six years old. That's probably the last, well, that's the youngest memory that I have of being a child. Was that a good memory? Yeah. It was a really good memory. There was a lot of family and friends there and it was in my front yard. That was actually when my mother's house was still red.
Speaker 0 00:08:52 You refer to your mother, are you talking about your foster mother?
Speaker 2 00:08:56 Yeah. So anytime I ever talk about my mother, unless I say, Oh, I'm talking about my biological mother and my mother is my foster mother is my adopted mother. She's the one that I grew up with. She's the one that raised me. Yeah. When I say mother, that is always that just my mother.
Speaker 0 00:09:12 What was the dynamic growing up with all these kids in the house? Were you, you said you felt alone. Where were you forgotten in the shuffle? No, no,
Speaker 2 00:09:22 Not forgotten in the shuffle. I just more or less felt alone because I looked at it, you know, like, why did my parents give me up? And the biggest thing was my, my brother and sister that got adopted with my grandparents. Um, so they were blood. They adopted them and I was broken up from my, my siblings. And so knowing that I, I had so many questions growing up about why me? Why was I given up? Why was I the one that didn't end up with my biological
Speaker 0 00:09:47 Family? Did you get any answers to those questions or were those just internal questions?
Speaker 2 00:09:52 Um, those are internal questions and I still have yet to get, um, a direct answer from my mom as to why that I was split up from my siblings.
Speaker 0 00:10:02 You haven't asked her or you have asked her and she hasn't given you a director. Hasn't given me a direct answer. What sort of answer does she give you?
Speaker 2 00:10:09 Um, her answer has always been, uh, it, and it's, it's so weird the way that she does it, it's where she'll completely stray away from the question that I asked and just say that she loved me so much and that it hurt. Like she she'll start bringing up that when I was 18 months old, my biological mother tried to take me and my brother back from my mom, uh, for a total of 10 days. And that, that completely destroyed her and broke her heart. And so she always just goes to this one really sad moment in her life when I was taken away from her for a brief period of time. Um, so I never get a direct answer on why we got separated.
Speaker 0 00:10:46 Do you really want that answer? Do
Speaker 2 00:10:48 I, I, you know, as an adult now, it, it doesn't matter. But as a kid and as when I was growing up as a teenager and I was in those years, yeah. I wanted that answer. So for, for a long time, you know, I had all these, all these fucking questions that I just didn't have answers to. And as I grew up and I worked through them as an adult and I came to the understanding that doesn't really matter, you know, right now, no, I could give a shit last, but growing up, it wasn't an issue.
Speaker 0 00:11:15 How were you dealing with the lack of answers to your questions?
Speaker 2 00:11:20 I mean, I rebelled, I got in a lot of trouble. What kind of stuff did you do? What kind of stuff did I do? There was fights in elementary and middle school. I had started drinking and using at 12 years old.
Speaker 0 00:11:32 Okay. At 12 years old, you started drinking and using, what did that look like?
Speaker 2 00:11:37 The first time I ever drank, I have an older brother and older adopted brother brought home a half bottle of Bacardi Wemo, and it was a party drug. I still remember the drink because I can't even smell it without gagging. And he filled up a 10 ounce, 12 ounce glass cup, pours it in front of me. I'm 12 years old. I want to hang out with my older brother. So I take it and I slam it and he looks at me astonished. And this is, you know, at an age where you don't know anything about booze and granted, I'm a small person as it is right now. Picture me at 12, probably weighing 80, 85 pounds, four foot, nothing standing five, 10 minutes later. I don't feel anything like what's going on. You know, let me get some more he's again, looking at me like, what the hell is this? Kid's problem pours me up another glass of Bacardi, Ramon straight. And I remember this time vivid. We, because I smelled it, it smells disgusting. I almost puked just smelling it. I plugged my nose and I drank the whole thing. Why,
Speaker 0 00:12:35 Why did you, I don't
Speaker 2 00:12:36 Understand. I was looking for, you know, even at that age, like, it wasn't enough. It was weird that like right away, as soon as I took just a little drop of it, there was something inside of it that made me feel just a little bit different, but it wasn't enough for me, you know? Like what
Speaker 0 00:12:51 Do you mean? It made you feel a little bit different.
Speaker 2 00:12:53 I felt the little body, I, the little buzz, like, Oh, there's this warm, tingly sensation that you get when you drink alcohol. Like, if I were to go back out right now, it'd be that same. I guarantee I'd have a euphoric recall of that. Same time. I, that first time I drank is just that, that burning sensation that love and desire that you have for something. And you can't explain
Speaker 0 00:13:14 After the very first drink you got that. And then you wanted more
Speaker 2 00:13:18 And I wanted more. And so I took that next drink. We're going to fast forward that story into 30 minutes later, me stumbling down the stairs, puking all over the side of my bed, all over the floor. Yeah. At 12 you would think that with having such a bad experience with it, I probably wasn't going to drink alcohol again. You know, which is what a normal person would think. And I think that if you're not an alcoholic that happens to you, you're never going to touch fucking alcohol again. You're going to go back to that one moment in time that you thought you were going to die at 12 years old and you had not drank it. And so moving forward, alcohol was a, maybe a monthly thing every couple months. You know, I was 12 years old. My brother didn't have bottles just laying around at that time 12, that was right around the time where I started smoking weed. Weed had became my drug of choice as a child. And that was used to escape. That was used to cope with life. It felt like an outcast as it was. And so it's something that just brought me relief.
Speaker 0 00:14:17 You were seeking relief for this loneliness and these questions that you didn't have answers for. How did your drinking and drug use increase or did it decrease as you went into high school
Speaker 2 00:14:35 With weed? And I was smoking every day. My older brother was a, um, was a pot dealer. And so I was the younger brother of a pot dealer. And so I got free weed. I think in town, I was like 21. I never actually bought weed in my entire life. So we, it stayed prevalent
Speaker 3 00:14:52 Until I was like 17. It was a daily thing. It was, uh, before school, it was during school. I got suspended for smoking weed out on the bus before smoking weed in the bathroom. Before,
Speaker 0 00:15:02 Before you go any further, did your mom know any of this was going on? She was very oblivious to it. Do you think there it was because there were so many of you.
Speaker 3 00:15:11 Yeah, there are so many of us, so she couldn't keep an eye on all of us. Also, one thing I'd like to point out about my mom is, and this is what she told me, which I actually believe to be true. She took a sip of beer once in her entire life. She's never even seen drugs, never even smelled pot before we started bringing it into the house, smelling like weed. I mean, I first started smoking cigarettes when I was 15. So I could cover the scent of weed as soon as she found out what weed smell like I needed to start smoking cigarettes. Now my mom didn't want us smoking cigarettes, but it's not a drug. And so she didn't get that upset about it. There was a quite a few years there where she was extremely oblivious.
Speaker 0 00:15:49 And how did she respond when you got suspended from school, when you were having these consequences from your youth?
Speaker 3 00:15:56 It'd be an initial upset, but I do remember that when I was a child, um, and I would get suspended. It would turn into like a mother and sauna day where she would essentially reward me. We'd go shopping, I'd get a new outfit for school, go out to eat. We'd hang out. We'd spend time together. Okay.
Speaker 0 00:16:16 Why do you think that was versus being punished?
Speaker 3 00:16:19 I don't know. And that's something that I've never asked her before. It was almost like she just let everything play. Its course. I don't know if there was any, um, reason behind the, her decision to do that, but I, I never, ever really got punished for things like that. I would get yelled at, you know, in stern warning. And then I just go about my day.
Speaker 0 00:16:39 Do you think if she would've punished you, your behavior may have changed and this is nothing against your mom. I'm just saying in hindsight, looking back, do you think if you were seriously punished for your misgivings, do you think your trajectory would have changed
Speaker 3 00:16:56 Interesting that you asked that? Because that is another thing that's still as an adult. I just had to, when I, when I did my fifth step,
Speaker 0 00:17:05 You're talking about a fifth step that's in relation to the steps of alcoholics anonymous. Is that correct? Yes. And the fifth step is
Speaker 3 00:17:15 The fifth step is admitted to God, to yourself and to another human being, the exact nature of Iran. So in my fist up and in the calm of resentments, I had a lot of resentments towards my mother. And a lot of them resentments were directly related to how I was actually raised as a child. I wanted them resentments where I wasn't punished enough as a child. So yes, that is, that is something that I've looked back on. I use it as an excuse for a very long time. Well maybe if my mom would have yelled at me, maybe if I would've been grounded, maybe if I would've been whooped, you know, maybe if was actual
Speaker 2 00:17:50 Consequences to my actions, I would have turned out differently. Maybe I want to become an alcoholic. Nick. Who knows. Do you think that to be true? Absolutely.
Speaker 0 00:17:59 Absolutely not. So you weren't really punished when you were in high school, so the consequences really weren't that great. In fact, you were getting a reward for negative behavior.
Speaker 2 00:18:11 Yeah. I mean, I got a day off, you know, usually people get suspended, they got to sit in the room. They're going to focus on their schoolwork or no,
Speaker 0 00:18:20 I, that sucked. I hated getting in trouble. I mean, I got into a lot of it, but it didn't deter me from getting into more trouble. I wish my parents, that's a resentment. I'm going to put on my fifth step, mom, dad, you should have punished me less. Like Jared's mom, I'm wanting to get new clothes and have him have a cake and have a cake, have a suspension cake. Sounds really good suspension suspension. It's got chocolate in it. When you graduated from high school, I'm sorry. Did you graduate
Speaker 2 00:18:57 In high school? Um, no. I ended up, uh, dropping out in 11th grade because they were going to kick me out. So I just, what were they going to kick you out for? Um, 11th grade, that was, there was a fight in the 11th grade. Um, and also my attendance as I was showing up to school two days a week. And
Speaker 0 00:19:16 What did your mom have to say about that?
Speaker 2 00:19:18 She supported the decision. Actually the assistant principal had her in one day. You know, we sat there and talked about my attendance and it was basically you either get your hair and head out of your ass and you show up or you drop out. My mom agreed with me, you know, which of course I didn't want to be in school that, uh, why don't we just drop out and work on your GED? Did you work on your GED? It took me maybe six months. I did get my GED in order to listen to the military.
Speaker 0 00:19:43 So what did your drinking and drugging look like before you went into the military when you were getting that GED?
Speaker 2 00:19:51 Yeah. So leading up to that. So like I had said, I think it was from 12 to 17. It was pot everyday towards when I got into high school. That's when, um, we were old enough to know the older kids. Some people in high school looked old enough to get alcohol drinking became an every weekend thing. And these were, uh, you know, I wasn't a normal drinker. It'd be from Friday to Sunday, I was getting just shit faze, blacked out drunk. But then about 17 with marijuana, I got burnt out. I stopped liking the effect of it. I don't know if the weed got too good or I just, it started, it was a chemical imbalance in my brain where it didn't affect me the same. And so I no longer enjoyed getting high. Um, so at about 17, I just stopped smoking weed. You know, inches was no longer my thing. And also I started to really enjoy drinking up and telling through my GD process and going into becoming 18. Yeah. I was drinking two times a week, three times a week, maybe. And when you got to the point where
Speaker 0 00:20:48 You were ready to join the military, what branch did you go into by then?
Speaker 2 00:20:51 I joined the Marine Corps. Good for you, Semper fine motherfucker. Simplify motherfucker.
Speaker 0 00:20:56 You enlisted in the Marine Corps. What did your drinking and drugging look like?
Speaker 2 00:21:01 The same? I didn't smoke weed. I couldn't tell you the last time I did any hard drugs drinking on the weekends and upon enlisting, I graduated the Marine Corps drunk, the whole boot leave. And then when I went into why wasn't into the fleet yet when to my MOS school, which is what you're learning to do in the Marine Corps, your job, um, yeah, it was every weekend. And you know, at that point we are old enough to have people buy boots for us on base. I was still, you know, I was 18 years old. I went to bootcamp two weeks after I turned 18. So I'll my senior class was in high school, you know, I was in training. Um, and that was, I would drink a few days throughout the week. And then on the weekend, I'd just get wasted. Why did you decide on military service?
Speaker 2 00:21:43 You know, when I was younger, I always had a fascination for the military, you know, watching action movies and the likes, there was an aspect of it that I knew I needed discipline. I needed guidance. I hadn't found my calling in life. I didn't know what the fuck I was going to do. I'm fairly smart, but I didn't see myself going to college. So it's like, what does a guy do? And I just saw it as an opportunity. I also have a older sister who was in the Marine Corps. So that was, I think the deciding factor for me, you know, when I sat there and I talked to her over the phone, when she was stationed overseas, she had just kind of riled me up to the idea. And then at some point, you know, I wasn't going to high school. And so I walked into a recruiter's office, finished
Speaker 0 00:22:25 Your MLS school. And what was your concentration?
Speaker 2 00:22:28 I was a Meg attack, planning specialist, Marine air and ground taskforce planning specialist, because I was in communications. What do you mean communications and communication? Like a dope radio. I honestly, I was still in, in, uh, Matt platoon, um, Marines, awaiting training. I didn't not make it that far in the Marine Corps. What do you mean you didn't make it that far in the month? I made it through boot camp. So I earned my title of United States Marine. I went to Marine combat training. I graduated that and then they shipped us out to our school, which is where we're going to learn our MLS. And I think it was the first weekend I was there. I flew into Virginia Beach on a Wednesday by Friday. I was smoking weed by Monday. Um, we were all standing in front of, uh, legal admin in front of basically the lawyers or whatever the fuck they were. And we were getting in trouble for doing drugs fast forward that three months later I was other than honorably discharged.
Speaker 0 00:23:30 Other than
Speaker 2 00:23:32 That, other than it was not an honorable, it's not a bad conduct. It's not a court martial, but it's not honorable.
Speaker 0 00:23:39 So it's kind of like a no contest. It's kind of like you fucking idiot plead no contest, plea, no contest.
Speaker 4 00:23:46 I'm not guilty. I'm not going to contest this, which is, um,
Speaker 2 00:23:51 Um, this is the first time that I, I learned the lesson. I admit nothing, deny everything, make false accusations. So we were sitting in front of, um, you know, the command officer, uh, the seal, it says after we got in trouble and we had to take our UAS, well, we took our UA two days after we smoked weed. I'm thinking there is absolutely no way I'm going to pass this. And they're sitting there and scaring me with, you're going to get court-martialed if you don't tell the truth. And you know, and so I finally fess up and I'm like, I'm one of the Marines who was smoking off base. You know, they tried to get me to name other people. I was like, I just got here on Wednesday. I'll point them out to you in a lineup. I don't know their name. So they, they scare me into telling the truth that I smoked weed.
Speaker 2 00:24:31 And then when I'm sitting there getting 'em NJP, which is, it's just in front of a judge of military sorts, they asked me if I want to know what my drug test came back. And I said, honestly, no, like I told them myself, no, it came back negative. Nick, I could have lied and said that I did not smoke any weed. I would have lost my security clearance. I would have had to go somewhere else. Within the Marine Corps, they would have probably made me a fucking grunt, but I still would be in the, I can't say now because I was 14 years, 15 years ago, but there was a big possibility that I was going to not get kicked out.
Speaker 0 00:25:08 So you got kicked out. I got kicked out. What happened after that?
Speaker 2 00:25:11 Jared came back home to Minnesota. I am from here, born and raised, got a job. And that's really when my drinking started taking off due to resentments, due to anger, you know, that was the first time that I was like disappointed in myself. So when I was in bootcamp, I graduated as a squad leader. So four Marines out of 80 people in our platoon think so I, I was a squad leader in there. So I, I felt like I found my calling. I exceeded, I excelled. I did phenomenal, got the hell out of Minnesota. You know, I finally found something that I was good at and I wanted to do. And all it took was one, one time for me to smoke weed, to literally shit, the baddie and throw this beautiful opportunity away upon getting back. That's when I really started drinking heavily where it became a during the week became on the weekend kind of thing.
Speaker 0 00:26:04 And were you living at your mom's house at this time?
Speaker 2 00:26:06 Yes. So after I had came back, I moved back in with my mother. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:26:11 And what was her response to you being honorable? A dishonorable lead acquitted district?
Speaker 2 00:26:18 We're interested in, I can't remember if I told her the truth. I know there was some people that I told that I got medically discharged because I was so ashamed of what happened to me. Can't remember if I told my mom it was a medical discharge, or if I actually got kicked out,
Speaker 0 00:26:33 Did that shame of being kicked out of the military? Did that fuel your drinking? Absolutely. Like what am I going to do now? I'm a piece of shit, blah, blah, blah.
Speaker 2 00:26:41 Yeah. You know, like I said, I, I threw an amazing opportunity away. I recall, like for that first year after I got back, it was every morning. I would think about getting kicked out of the Marine Corps and every night before going to bed, just living with that shame, like for a year straight, I guarantee that I thought about it every morning and every night. So it, it, you know, it started to haunt me.
Speaker 0 00:27:04 What was the only way you were dealing with that haunting in that shame was the only way you were dealing with that was drinking. Yeah. You weren't talking to anybody about it? No, not a brother.
Speaker 2 00:27:16 No. That's something I kept to myself. I still walked around with this sense of pride because they don't strip that side of away from you. So I still, you know, it was like, I'm a United States Marine. And so there was this sense of confidence in myself still, but at the same time, deep down inside, it was like, what the fuck? It's extremely, I don't know about embarrassing, but it's not something I would share to people. You know that, yeah. I was in the Marine Corps and I got kicked out, you know, most, well, I wouldn't say most people, but I can see people thinking like, Oh, it'd be cool or tough to say, Oh, you got kicked out. And it's funny, but it wasn't funny to me, you know? Cause it was a fucking calling for me.
Speaker 0 00:27:52 You missed out on your calling or so you thought, what were you doing when you came home? Were you working? Were you going back to school? What were you doing?
Speaker 2 00:27:59 I believe I got a job at Menards and that had lasted for about eight mines, I think until I got, uh, I got fired for my attendance, which is always been an issue in my drinking.
Speaker 0 00:28:11 Yeah. Interesting. And what did your continued use look like? Did it just get progressively worse? Were there any times where you got a period of sobriety in there? Because you've been sober for how long now?
Speaker 2 00:28:23 I got five months tomorrow right now.
Speaker 0 00:28:25 Granulations but all we have is today. You're goddamn, right? Or I'm sorry. I can't say God damn. My mom gets mad when I say that on my show. You're damn right. Sorry. The next mom you're damn right next mom. My mom. Yeah. Nailed it. Did you have periods of sobriety? Because you're how old now? 32. You are 32. So between the time that you came back from the Marine Corps to now, how many times have you attempted to get sober?
Speaker 2 00:28:55 I attempted to get sober. I'd say two. Well, there was, we'll call it three times.
Speaker 0 00:29:01 What was the longest stretch of sobriety you've ever had?
Speaker 2 00:29:04 It was about five and a half months. I had 99 days. I went out and drank one night and then I went back into recovery right away and yeah, it was, I was approaching the six month Mark and tide went out and relapsed.
Speaker 0 00:29:17 What did your drinking use look like right before you got help? The first time were you drinking all day? Every day. Where, yeah. What did that look like for you
Speaker 2 00:29:26 Or the first time? So the first time that I, um, took sobriety seriously was when I was 19 years old, there was the Marine Corps, 18 to eight and a half years old. Then I got out and the following year when I got a car for the first time, I got two DUIs in a year. Um, within three weeks, three weeks of each other, you had two DUIs within three weeks. Yeah, the first one, I was a hit and run. Fender-bender ran into somebody, drove off, pulled over and they followed me and they boxed me in cops are called second one was yeah, three weeks later using a friend's guy, you know? And I still have yet to tell him I have amends to make to this gentlemen. So yeah, that was three weeks. So according to these for DUIs in Minnesota, you have to take a chemical eval and you have to go to treatments.
Speaker 2 00:30:15 And, uh, that first time I went to river plays in a NOCCA for my first treatment center. Um, and that's when I think I did my first actual first step up until then. And what is this first step at admitted? We are powerless over alcohol and that our lives had become unmanageable. Um, that was the first time that I like realized I had a drinking problem. So I've drank a lot up until them, but I never really saw it as a problem. Didn't grow up around OCA holics I didn't grow up with anybody who was in and out of recovery. So I didn't really know what alcoholism was about at all. Until I had gone to treatment. We're going to take a little break right there. And when we come back, Jared is going to talk about his experience with
Speaker 1 00:30:58 Help. Love yours, love yours, no such thing, no such thing as a life that's better than yours. No such thing as life <inaudible> heartbeat affairs, let a nigga know that he alive fake niggas, man, snakes, snakes in the grass. Let a nigga know that he arrived. Don't be sleeping on your level because it's beauty in the struggle. Nigga is beauty in the struggle. Negativity is beauty in the struggle ugliness in this success, him my words and listen to my signal, a distress. I grew up in the city and no, sometimes we had less compared to some of my niggas down the block, man, we were blessed and life can't be no fairy tale. No once upon a time. But I be goddamned for nigga. Don't be trying to tell me, momma, please. Why you be drinking? Not at the time. Dissolve the pain he brought. You're still linger in your mind. Cause pain still lingers on mine on the road to riches. Listen, this is what's a five. The good news is nigga. You came a long way.
Speaker 0 00:32:40 The bad news is nigga. You went the wrong way. Welcome. Welcome, Jared. Do you want to, do you want to sing with me or do you want to sing? Welcome back. Are you a singer? What are we singing there? Well, you can sing whatever you want. We're going to sing. Welcome back. Let's do that. Okay. Well, um, finish it. Wow. I didn't know. You could hit that note. Wow. That was really good. Marla liked it. She should. She shook for it. You're a really beautiful individual. Thank you, Nick. Inside and out, inside and out. And you're, you're singing voices. Impeccable mountainous. Marvelous. Yes, God. I know. That's why we're friends because we do shit like that. All right. Let's get back to it. You were talking about before the break about at 19 years old, you're not even of legal drinking age yet and you're starting to take sobriety seriously. You've entered a treatment center for the first time. And you talked about taking that first step. Seriously. We admitted we were powerless over alcohol and that our lives had become unmanageable. How would you explain your powerlessness over alcohol and the unmanageability of your life at that point?
Speaker 2 00:34:06 Plenum 19. So we can look back from 12 to 17. So a big thing when it first, first go around and treatment is they make you write the list of your first data views, putting 12 down for smoking weed. And it's pretty fucking young putting drink down for 12. It's pretty fucking young. Um, you know, and up until 19, I had done a lot of fucking drugs. I always considered myself a recreational user when it came to heavy drugs. But I mean, when you smoke methamphetamines, it doesn't matter if you do it once or a hundred times, you just smoked methamphetamines. My unmanageability there upon 19 was losing two jobs already getting two DUIs. So I was losing my license within a year of having my license crashing and car, and it was getting kicked out of the Marine Corps. So at that very young age, I had already felt like I lost.
Speaker 0 00:35:00 What sort of help did you receive at this first treatment center that you went to after these consequences that you actually took seriously? And no one was rewarding you this time for those consequences, what were you learning?
Speaker 2 00:35:12 I think at that time I was learning that I was able to enjoy life solver. That was the biggest takeaway from that for me, I still remember so river place, they used to have a place called awake place where you'd go up to last week, a treatment and you were in a cabin full of food. And that's when you wrote out your first ear for step and you know, you would do the fifth step with a pastor or something like that. But during that time, it was over at the sovereign. And I remember going on a paddle boat with another one of the gentlemen in treatment, like getting stuck in the middle of the Lake. We couldn't figure out how to fucking steer it. So we're just going in circles over and over and over. And I'm enjoying myself for the first time. And I can't tell you how long without substance inside of me that first time in recovery, I think it was just learning how to enjoy life. Again, being sober
Speaker 0 00:36:02 That you did a fourth and fifth step while you were in treatment. And the fourth step is
Speaker 2 00:36:08 When is the first time come com
Speaker 0 00:36:12 Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves. So when you were making that searching and fearless, moral inventory of yourself, what sort of patterns were you learning? What were you learning about yourself? Because you said you learned, you could have fun sober. I'm sure you learned more than just, I can have fun without drinking. What were you learning about yourself?
Speaker 2 00:36:34 I really cannot remember. And for being 100% honest, well, I would hope you're being 100%, 100% honest,
Speaker 0 00:36:43 No such thing as 100%, right? 99.9%
Speaker 2 00:36:46 99.9% positive. I don't remember. So that's that's um, and I don't know if this is due to the excess of drinking or drug use, which I'm sure it is. There's a lot of years really only remember bits and pieces of things. So if you were to sit here and when you asked me about my childhood and I kind of started talking about it, there's not much I remember about my childhood other than the major things that happened just don't really have the memory of it,
Speaker 0 00:37:11 Perhaps that's not just due to your excessive drinking and drug use, but also it sounds like a traumatic beginning to life. Yeah. Do you think it might be due to that trauma or at least partly due to,
Speaker 2 00:37:26 It could be partly due to that trauma of me, not wanting to remember a lot of things, if that's where you're going with that. Yeah. There's just a lot of things I'd rather not remember
Speaker 0 00:37:35 Asking you to look a little deeper than, Oh, it was just the drugs and the alcohol. And that's why I can't remember shit for a lot of people in recovery. There are things that are just repressed drinking and drugging provided a solution for that. And yeah, there are some things I don't remember because I drank a lot and I dragged a lot. However, there are some things that were so painful. My brain pushed them away and I didn't have that memory anymore. Do you think that's,
Speaker 2 00:38:04 That could be part of it. Yeah,
Speaker 0 00:38:07 To me, it just sounds like a very traumatic way to come up in the world that must've been really lonely. I'm sorry that you had to go through that.
Speaker 2 00:38:15 Thank you, Nick. You're welcome. I love you. Did
Speaker 0 00:38:19 I love you too. I can't imagine what that would be like. And it's just like being an alcoholic. You can't really know what it's like to be an alcoholic, unless you're an alcoholic. I can't know what it's like to grow up in the foster system and to be given by my birth mother, because it's never happened to me. I want you to know that. I'm sorry that that happened to you. And I know that happens to a lot of children out there. I hope that someone that's listening can take away that you don't have to be alone and you can talk about it even if it takes 30 years.
Speaker 2 00:38:53 I agree. I agree. 100%
Speaker 0 00:38:57 Long after this treatment at the age of 19, correct? 19. Yep. So how long after this inpatient treatment were you back to drinking?
Speaker 2 00:39:06 Three months? So treatment was 30 day program. I remember in the treatment program, I had a, uh, requested to go to a sober house. I knew that if I were to go directly from treatment back home, it was going to be no one time that I was drinking. I just had this feeling about myself and I, I felt that I needed structure my lifestyle and I needed to be surrounded around sober people in that environment. So I had went to a halfway house in Wisconsin. So that halfway house I was there for, it was two months or two and a half months. And it was, it was funded through the state because I didn't have insurance at the time.
Speaker 0 00:39:45 And I'm glad that you mentioned that because there are so many halfway houses and treatment centers that are funded by the state or the federal government. You don't have to worry about money, right? There's so many ways to get help, especially in the state of Minnesota when you can file for a rule.
Speaker 2 00:40:02 Twenty-five. Yeah, that was, I mean, every time I had, you know, got to a, the breaking point to a rock bottom, um, and I knew I needed to sober up. That was one of the great things. It doesn't matter what the fuck you're doing in life, where you're at in life, how much money you do or don't have. You're always going to be taken care of by the state of Minnesota.
Speaker 0 00:40:18 If you want to be sober, if you want to try and get clean, if you want some help, literally people, all you have to do is Google rule 25, and you will get all the information you need about getting some help and it doesn't cost
Speaker 2 00:40:33 Doesn't cost anything. And you can honestly be in a treatment center within 24 hours. If you try hard enough to get there, there's hope there is hope and there's help back to the help. Yeah. Back to the health.
Speaker 0 00:40:44 You were in this halfway house for two, two and a half months, two and a half months, the structure was great. You were around people that were sober because you knew that if you weren't in that situation, you weren't going to stay.
Speaker 2 00:40:55 It allowed me to, I don't think I was doing too much soul searching at that moment in time in my life, still young, still fucking dumb. I was working towards physical health. When I say that it's not just, Oh, it was getting buff and Jack, but I was actually taking care of my body. I was eating healthier. I was working out, you know, hour and a half a day. I was really, you know, focused on myself and being positive. At that point, I was, it was a requirement maybe two times a week to go to meetings. Um, I was still going six days a week. Everything that I did was related to a program of recovery.
Speaker 0 00:41:27 So, and these are AA meetings that you were going to. What did you find most helpful about those AA meetings when you first went, when you were 19?
Speaker 3 00:41:34 When I first went, when I was 19, um, that was the point when I realized I wasn't alone because growing up and when I was struggling with my addiction, like I never understood why I picked up and then I couldn't put down, I can't just have a beer. I can't just have two beers. It was drinking and towel. I was blacking out drinking and I was going to bat. I never understood why. And I, I felt alone. I felt like I was doing one who is like that. You know, even going with friends who had drank a lot, they weren't drinking. Like I was, I was on a whole nother level of I'm getting absolutely fucking smashed, wasted, stumbling around, acting a fool, being a dumb as like, why are all these people enjoying this? And granted I'm having a good time, but I'm like, I'm drinking to an excess where I no longer can control myself walking into meetings for the first time and hearing other people's stories. I actually realized that there were other people out there like me and that I directly related to them.
Speaker 0 00:42:28 And what sort of solutions or what sort of skills were they sharing with you so that you could remain sober? Because you said once you picked up, you couldn't,
Speaker 3 00:42:37 Don't put down. This is where we get into the part where I point out that it took me 32 years to actually get a true sponsor and work the steps. And what's a sponsor. A sponsor is somebody who has successfully worked the 12 steps and continued to work them on a daily basis. And he is there to guide you and help support you through your process in the early stages of recovery and into hopefully the rest of your,
Speaker 0 00:43:02 And you said he, because typically in the AA program, it's men helping men and women, helping women kind of obvious reasons, but that is no by no means the rule. And that's the great thing about AA is that there are no rules. There are steps which are suggested. It's literally the words that they use. These are steps that are suggested as a program of recovery because this worked for us. So these are the suggestions we got and our out rules
Speaker 3 00:43:29 Not realize there are no rules.
Speaker 0 00:43:31 Like this is how we did it when we want to help you do it. And that in a microcosm that's sponsorship, I got this and I want to help you get this if you want this. So what did you learn from going to AA meetings? What didn't you learn from going to AA meetings that took you back out? How long were you
Speaker 3 00:43:50 That time? Again, it was, it was so three, three and a half months until I lost the funding at, um, the halfway house. I don't remember why or how, but there is no longer we're going to pay for it. So at that point in time, I had moved back. Well, I had moved in with my birth mom for the first time in my life had I had lived with her. I had nowhere else to go.
Speaker 0 00:44:10 What sort of relationship did you have with her prior to moving in with her?
Speaker 3 00:44:15 I'm moving in with her. It was just a friendly relationship growing up. I had an open adoption, which is, um, you can still have contact with your biological parents. Can you explain what kind of contact, what kind of contact up until 12? They were visits is what they'd be called. They were, um, unsupervised visits. All my
Speaker 2 00:44:32 Mom would drop me off, you know, at like a McDonald's or, um, there's a place called the mermaid and app. It's a Nokia County somewhere, and that was always the meetup spots. My mom would bring me there. Um, and then I'd go and see my brother and sisters and my grandparents see my birth mom. They could be overnights. And again, they were unsupervised, you know, my mom wasn't birth mom. Wasn't at risk of taking me. I mean, she couldn't take care of her fucking self. She wasn't gonna abductor the child self until 12. It was, you know, unsupervised visits, lost contact for about four years. But then after that, I just see her on Christmas, uh, at certain Thanksgiving, you know, a couple of times throughout the year, I'd go and spend the night there, you know? And so it was never so much like a, a mother son relationship, like granted, she is my mom and she would act as my mom in a sense, it was more of just being my friend. And so up until that point, um, you know, we had a friend, we relationship I a couple of times before this time where I moved in, if I was in trouble or, you know, I'd say at a party and a fight broke out or something I needed to get saved. I could, she was the one I can't call my mother. My adopted mom can call her at three o'clock in the morning with my fucking drinking problems, but I could call her and have her come save me.
Speaker 0 00:45:42 Is that the kind of relationship that you wanted?
Speaker 2 00:45:46 Yeah, I mean, I'd rather, I'd much rather have that it moves forward into when I started webbing with her, she's started to try and take on more of a parental role as she's still in the adapts of addiction herself. What
Speaker 0 00:45:58 Is your birth? Mother's drug of choice. It's
Speaker 2 00:46:00 Methamphetamines. And she's also an alcoholic.
Speaker 0 00:46:02 Is she still in active use? She,
Speaker 2 00:46:05 As far as I'm concerned as an active use, but she's functioning somehow.
Speaker 0 00:46:11 You're funding at your halfway house. You left there and you moved in with your birth
Speaker 2 00:46:15 With her. And within, I think it was four hours. I was on the beach and I still remember this vividly, um, went to Lake Calhoun with my older brother, and that started my Western, his drinking career for the second time.
Speaker 0 00:46:31 How long did that second stretch of drinking and drugging last for,
Speaker 2 00:46:35 Um, 19 until 24?
Speaker 0 00:46:40 What was it at age 24 that you decided this time that you needed to stop again
Speaker 2 00:46:46 In between that stretch? There is a lot that happened. So at 19 I went back out, I went and I was drinking that point. That became an everyday thing. I was just turning 20 that year. So for the next year, I can't tell you, and if I didn't drink a day, so in single digits, so I was a year straight, moved out to California. I was there for two years in California. That was, um, another moment in my life. They kind of, I look at it like, uh, what had happened in the Marine Corps. I was living on the beach, actually had a condo on the beach. I had a job out there. I had a great girlfriend. The biggest thing is fucking California. I hate Minnesota. It's too cold here. And, uh, and here you sit and yeah. And here I, and so again,
Speaker 3 00:47:30 You know, I'm looking at these opportunities in front of me and I'm looking at like where I am in life and I'm just feel great, but my drinking is excessive. Ultimately ended up getting in a lot of trouble out there. And so it was either I stay there and I face the consequences or I'd come back to the state of Minnesota. That's at 23 years old. I'm now having to move back to Minnesota. I'm having to walk back with my tail between my legs, you know, with another disappointment, with another, Hey, I had fucking everything in front of me and all these opportunities and options and life was just grand there. And I just shit the bad yet again. So I came back here and now that leads on to another very hard and heavy year of drinking. I'm dealing with our heartbreak again, not having a purpose in life, not knowing where I'm going or what I'm going to do, or like losing that opportunity again. So I think it really took another really big fuck up and losing, you know, not living in California and having to come back here again for me to get to rock bottom. Then I think that time, um, at about 24, I was at rock bottom again. Um, emotionally, physically, mentally,
Speaker 0 00:48:36 What did rock bottom actually look like for you on all levels? Emotionally, mentally, spiritually,
Speaker 3 00:48:42 Physically, um, physically. It was to the point where I was going through withdrawals. If I
Speaker 0 00:48:47 Didn't drink. And what did those withdrawals
Speaker 3 00:48:49 Look like? Um, my withdrawals entail, uh, night terrors, uh, night sweats. I can't eat can't sweep, shake muscle fatigue. Biggest thing is the nightmares. I say nightmares. I've very livid and fucked up nightmares when I'm going through withdrawals. And that was actually the first time in my life that it was that bad. I mean, in my early twenties, I could stay up all night drinking, wake up after four hours of sleep, drink some water, eat some breakfast, and I was fucking golden. You know, I, I didn't feel like I was having withdrawals and I was starting to get that stage and drinking and in life where I was getting a little bit older, my body could no longer tolerate and handle and break down the alcohol
Speaker 0 00:49:29 Possibly. So your body was saying, fuck you, body was in a big, fuck you. And where were you at emotionally? You said you were dealing with a breakup. What else was going on? Do you think it was an amplified state of this shame and let down
Speaker 3 00:49:43 Yeah. And guilt and, you know, looking at where I am at, at, in life at 24 grant since yeah. Since 19 never had a license. I lost my license at 19. Still. Haven't got my license back. Still have never had my own apartments though. I've never had my own place. Was always either staying with a parent or a girlfriend. Hadn't found a career job yet. Hadn't found stable employment. Couldn't keep a job. So yeah, that, that takes a toll on your emotional state because you're looking at rewind five years, I was in the Marine Corps and I was going to make something of myself to five years later. And I'm just as drunk piece of shit. Who's not doing anything in life with, with all the opportunity in the world. I grew up and from teachers and principals and this, I usually always heard when I was getting in trouble is I had so much potential. So the older I got when I wasn't amounting to anything and knowing, you know, just growing up in hearing, you have so much potential, you have so much potential. And I just still, wasn't doing shit with my wife. It, you know, it was, it weighed on me.
Speaker 0 00:50:48 I'm glad you made that segue earlier, being at these lower States. One thing that I haven't asked you yet, what sort of spirituality did you grow up with? Did you have, at that time, spirituality, did you grow up in any sort of,
Speaker 3 00:51:05 Yeah, I, uh, growing up, we went to church every Sunday and that was, we went to a Lutheran church. So my mom is, um, fairly religious.
Speaker 0 00:51:18 Do you think about that? What, what was your relationship?
Speaker 3 00:51:21 You know, and when I, up until I was about 10, 11, 12, when I started doing drugs and drinking, you know, I went to this, uh, it was like a Bible school, not like Monday through Friday Bible school. Um, but I went to Bible school. It was on like Wednesdays or something like that. <inaudible> so I used to rehearse biblical transcripts or whatever. They passages, Bible passages. And I was fairly involved in the church. And then, you know, I got to an age where I was being dragged and forced to go to church. And at that point it was, you know, fuck God,
Speaker 0 00:51:52 Fuck God. Would it be fair to say that drugs and alcohol became your new
Speaker 3 00:51:58 God? Absolutely. My new guy. And it became my best friend became, you know, all my better half. The one thing that I could rely on.
Speaker 0 00:52:06 What did your spirituality look like when you were at rock bottom at the age of 26?
Speaker 3 00:52:12 There is no spirituality whatsoever in my life. What
Speaker 0 00:52:15 Did you think about God?
Speaker 3 00:52:17 Fuck him. Fuck God, fuck him.
Speaker 0 00:52:20 Did you think there was anything bigger out there holding onto something for you? Any sort of purpose or meaning, or had you given up?
Speaker 3 00:52:29 I was at a point where I wanted to give up. Um,
Speaker 0 00:52:32 They give up, but you didn't. So then what did you do?
Speaker 3 00:52:35 I ended up finding a, another treatment. Okay.
Speaker 0 00:52:39 I found another treatment center. I've only been to one treatment so far and I hope it's the only treatment that I go through in my life. Yeah. Knock on that fucking wood, bro. And that's, what's so important to me about taking things one day at a time, like you said earlier, when I went to treatment, I talked to people that had been to multiple treatments and the common theme that they would, or th the thing that was common about them was they would always say what was going to be different this time, why this time in treatment, it was going to stick why they were going to stay sober. Okay. So what was your it's going to be different this time? Because
Speaker 3 00:53:19 I didn't ever want to be that low. Again, upon that time, I was actually starting to have suicidal thoughts. I grew up with the understanding that suicide is a form of selfishness and a form of weakness. And I never saw myself as somebody who wanted to take my life, but there were them thoughts there that I hate my life. This is pointless. What am I doing here? Why am I here? It just be better. If I'm dead, I'm sick and tired of struggling. I'm sick and tired of being broken and alone. And I didn't want to feel like that. So when I went into recovery that time, it was because I wanted to live. If you asked me what was different about that time, it was that I had hope as long as I do what I have to do that I'll never have to feel like that. Again,
Speaker 0 00:54:02 You go through this treatment at 24. Mm. You didn't stay sober because again, you didn't get sober until this time around. It was, uh, five months ago, tomorrow, five months ago, tomorrow. So how long did you stay sober this time? Because you said you wanted to live and you didn't want to be rock bottom anymore. So how long did you stay sober for and what happened? That sobriety ended. So
Speaker 3 00:54:29 That time around, you know, and I actually I'm I'm I completely missed a whole part that brought me into that treatment. It was because I wanted to, but I also was doing it partially for a court reason, nudge from the judge. It was a, well, I had done it before I, I had got in front of a judge. So it was kind of one of them, things that I wanted, I wanted it to look good. I had got in a car accident a few months or six months, eight months prior to that, um, on the highlight, it was pretty bad. I was all over the news, you know? And that then stopped me from drinking.
Speaker 0 00:55:01 How long did you stay sober for before you started drinking? Okay. Um, no, I just want like the straight up answer. How long did you stay sober for before you started drinking at nine months. Nine months. And what happened at that end of the nine months that you decided that you wanted to drink again? That very thing that took you to the place where you never wanted to be again? Why did you pick up?
Speaker 3 00:55:24 I missed it. You missed it. I missed it at that time. I remember the last month. So when I say nine months, it was a nine consecutive. There was 99 days. There was one slip up and then it was another like five and a half months. It's I got to that point. But at the end of that five and a half months for about a month before I, I actually called our dear friend to see if he wanted to hang out with me and drink. I went to bed and I thought about drinking. I woke up and I thought about drinking. I was at a meeting and I thought about drinking. I was working not about drinking. I was working out. I thought about drinking. There was a whole month of obsession. Did you
Speaker 0 00:55:58 Tell anyone that you were obsessing about
Speaker 3 00:56:00 Drinking? No, absolutely not. I kept it to myself. That's a, that was another reason why that time in recovery did not work. And when I say I was in recovery, was I work in this stops? No, I was not. Was I working with a sponsor and no, I was not. I was going to meetings and I thought that was enough. There's been so many times that I've been in recovery, sitting there reading the 12 steps, sitting there, listening to people, share, sitting there, being told, get a sponsor. And it never actually clicked to me that I needed to get a fucking sponsor and work the steps. It didn't make any sense to me, you know? So I went in and out then I kept failing and I kept failing and I kept wondering, why the fuck is this happening to me? What am I doing wrong? I'm doing everything right. I'm going to meetings. I'm staying sober. I'm living my life. I'm being a good person. I'm working on myself. What the fuck am I doing wrong? And then 20 minutes later, walking into a meeting, they're reading how it works. You know, they're reading the 12 steps. I'm still asking, what am I doing wrong is I'm not working the fucking steps.
Speaker 0 00:56:57 You were obsessing about drinking for one month for a whole month. And then you finally took a drink.
Speaker 3 00:57:03 Finally took a drink. And it was actually, I had a friend come over and you know, I bought a, bought a bottle of Jack Daniels. I still remember. And he drank about a half of it with me. And then he left. And I remember I had a, I was in a serious relationship at the time he leaves and I was instantly alone and I was instantly depressed and I was sad and I was looking back and I just threw five and a half months away. What the fuck am I doing? Just miserable. Why am I here again? I, it, it did not take long for me to get to a depressed state. It literally took somebody leaving me. And I felt abandoned for me to sit in my room and cry. And as my ex-girlfriend comes and she's trying to come from me, but also trying to take the bottle. I'm like, don't fucking touch my bottle. That's all the time.
Speaker 0 00:57:46 Why me? Why this again? Why this again? And what was your answer? What was my answer? Why me? Why me? Why this again? Why this again? How did this happen again? Right? What's the
Speaker 3 00:57:57 Answer? The answer. I wasn't working a program.
Speaker 0 00:58:00 You weren't working a program. Well, if that's the answer and you knew the answer, why didn't you just fucking do it?
Speaker 3 00:58:07 That's the million dollar question. Nick. Maybe
Speaker 0 00:58:10 It's not so much as a question as it is an explanation of what addiction really is. Yeah. Addiction is two parts. It's your body. And it's your mind. They say in the program that we are bodily and mentally different from our fellows. So that means that in our minds, we have an obsession to use or drink. Like you were talking about for that last month of your second stint of sobriety, you have that obsession of the mind, and you also have the phenomenon of craving, which means once you put a drink in your body, you need more, you need more. I crave more. I crave more. I crave more. There's something that happens inside my body. I have an allergic reaction. If you want to look at it that way, I have an allergy to alcohol. I have a physical allergy to it. And that was the explanation that I got. And that is what kept me is because I finally had an answer to why me, why me? Why can't I stop? Why can't I stop? You said you weren't working the steps, the solution was there. Why do you think that was? Or are you not? You're just like, I'm not done yet. I'm only 24. I got to drink some more. I got to see some more experiences or had you just given up. I think I'd
Speaker 3 00:59:22 Given up at that point. I was no longer enjoying recovery
Speaker 0 00:59:25 And not enjoying recovery. You might
Speaker 3 00:59:27 As well drink. You might as well fucking drink. You know? And so when I was younger, I did always, and I might've like jinxed or cursed myself, but I always told myself that at 30, I was, it was going to be 30 when I sobered up and I got my shit together. And that's when I was going to settle down and have a family. So I look back on it, like I did need to go through a lot more, a lot more shit in life. Maybe I wasn't done. Who knows if I were to got a sponsor that moment in time, there's a possibility that'd be rich to this day, but I didn't. And so that's something that I can't dwell on. The best answer is I wasn't ready if you can be in, in a room. Because at that point in time, I mean, I was on a house arrest for two months out of that. Then in sobriety, in which I wasn't able to go to any meetings, it was work and come home work and come home. But at that moment in time, like out of that nine months, minus the two months of house arrest, I was going to a meeting five or six days a week. So five or six days a week times, whatever math you want to do, I would say I went to a hundred and 150 meetings, right. People were giving me the solution every day, but I wasn't hearing the fucking solution. So,
Speaker 0 01:00:30 And that's the best answer I've gotten from you all night is that you didn't want it yet. You weren't ready yet. And that is, I think that's the biggest misconception that people have when they have a loved one that is in active addiction. They just can't understand. We give them all these things to help them. But at the end of the day, that person has to want that. And if they don't want it, they're not going to keep it. And they're not going to, how long did this next stint of drinking and drugging last?
Speaker 3 01:01:05 Um, we're going to go from 25 to, or just this last time. Well,
Speaker 0 01:01:10 So 25 up until 32.
Speaker 3 01:01:13 Yeah, no, no, there was sorry. There was another there's another one is there was another one in there. Um, we're going to say 27. Yeah.
Speaker 0 01:01:25 Okay. And where were you at then? Were you at another lower rock? Bottom? Yeah.
Speaker 3 01:01:30 Yeah. This time again, this was suicidal where it wasn't just like thoughts. I was putting a gun to my head and, you know, granted, I never pulled the trigger. I again was at a, just an extremely fucking little place. I don't remember where I was living or what I was doing. I just remember that it was an no, no, I, I do remember I was living in a house in the West side with our, with our dear friend there. And it was a drinking and drugging every day. And this is now I'm bringing hard drugs into the equation. I lost two jobs within like three months. I lost two apartments within three months. I, I was in a very serious relationship and I lost that woman to my drinking. And so there was a lot of gain, a lot of guilt and a lot of shame in there.
Speaker 3 01:02:11 And I was again at a very low spot and I knew I needed change. And that time I afterwards had went to a sober house upon completing treatment. Um, I was in the sober house for about six months. I think this was the first time I got a sponsor. I briefly worked with them for three weeks. Maybe I got to my fourth step. I did a couple of pages on my fourth step. And, uh, I allowed myself. I gave myself, um, a million excuses why I needed to move out of that sober house. And then I was back off to drinking for another three.
Speaker 0 01:02:46 And here you sit sober, clean and serene
Speaker 3 01:02:50 For five months tomorrow. But all we have is today. I've had three, you know, like I said earlier in the interview, I've had three. I like to call them stints at Sprite. And each one I did learn something at each one. I needed it at each one. If I didn't take that moment, if I didn't take that break from active use, I'm not sure if I would have survived. What's
Speaker 0 01:03:10 Different this time chaired.
Speaker 3 01:03:12 I got a sponsor and I worked a fucking steps, Nick,
Speaker 0 01:03:15 That's it. That's it. That's simple for
Speaker 3 01:03:17 Me. Willingness. If you were to ask me, what is the most important part in my program of recovery today? It's willingness.
Speaker 0 01:03:25 Are you willing to do this willingness? What are these anythings?
Speaker 3 01:03:29 Anything? Um, so this would sound like something. I am not wanting to kiss you because that is not gonna help my recovery. I will do anything. That's recovery based. Oh, and you know, Nick, get over here.
Speaker 0 01:03:40 The kiss me on the cheek. You can kiss my bald head.
Speaker 3 01:03:44 I thought you were going to say a second. I thought you were going there.
Speaker 0 01:03:51 It's your head gutter. You filthy ginger.
Speaker 3 01:03:54 This time, it's willingness and willingness look like willingness. It looks like to me. So you follow simple suggestions, bias sponsor, which I have. And upon getting him, he gave me a few, uh, uh, they weren't requirements. They were simple suggestions that it was, I either follow them or maybe it's not going to work out. And what were some of these suggestions? Simplest suggestion is call him every day. Nick, I don't like calling people, but I'm going to call him
Speaker 0 01:04:22 Every day. So why are you calling him every day? Because he told me he wants me to call him every day. Why do you think he said that?
Speaker 3 01:04:28 Why do I think he's said I still haven't figured it out?
Speaker 0 01:04:31 Can I shine a little light on that? Shine, a little light on that. Maybe he asks you to call him every day because that call puts another thing between you and your next drink.
Speaker 3 01:04:43 And my next rank, I can see that. I mean, yesterday alone, we, we still, you know, there's been days in the last five months that I haven't called them. Um, so it hasn't been every day, but it's six out of seven days, guaranteed. We still can talk on a phone for 45 minutes
Speaker 0 01:04:57 For somebody that doesn't like to talk on the phone, that <inaudible>,
Speaker 3 01:05:02 It's a miracle, a soul calling another addict. And that's an everyday thing. Now we're going to let him listen to this and some of the time, cause I'm having told them I'm on a podcast yet, but we're going to let them know it doesn't happen every night. But the fact that I still pull my phone out and I still call people when I don't want to. It's huge. That's the willingness there. Another thing
Speaker 0 01:05:23 That's put between you and your next drink is calling another addict to remind you that you're one, yeah.
Speaker 3 01:05:28 Two that I'm wanting to go to three meetings a week.
Speaker 0 01:05:31 You have these three things you have meeting with the sponsor. You have calling another addict or alcoholic or whatever, and you have going to meetings,
Speaker 3 01:05:40 Going to meetings. Yep. What else? No, I think that was it. That sounds pretty good to me. That that is all it takes for me, with everybody there different, you know, obviously thick headed in the past. And I figured that my way was better, you know? Cause cause all those times that I heard get a sponsor and work the steps. If I wasn't doing it clearly, it's because I knew better. And it's because I didn't think I fucking needed that. And now at this time I upon finding one and work in this steps, I, I don't have to do much in retrospect. And in a hindsight when me and him sit there and talk about it, the bare minimum, he calls it, the bare minimum is calling him, calling somebody else on. I'm supposed to pray every morning. And every night I get down on my knees and I pray,
Speaker 0 01:06:24 What is your prayer life look like? What does, what does praying sound like? What do you say?
Speaker 3 01:06:30 Praying sounds like to me. So I have a morning routine. It took me a few months to get to this point where I could do it day in and day out. So I wake up and I write a gratitude with five things that I'm grateful for. And what are you grateful for today? Grateful for today? Uh, the easiest one as always is I'm grateful to be sober, but I think this morning on my gratitude list, I wrote that I'm grateful that I have this new space heater that I have running in my freezing back in my freezing bathroom. If it's the simple things like this things. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 0 01:07:01 Back to, Hey, it's not just about me and what I want and what I need. It's not just about me. And I have gratitude for the things that are granted to me by the universe, by whatever it's getting outside of myself. And sounds like a little bit of humility being humble and talking about gratitude. What are you most grateful about in this new stint of sobriety?
Speaker 3 01:07:27 It's to actually have the mindset. I'm grateful for the mindset that I have in this, um, in this moment, because again, in and out, in and out of recovery, I'm not going to say it gets old because every time I'm in recovery, I'm now like all fuck I did. I wish I didn't fuck up all those other times, but I'm grateful that, that I finally got my head out of my ass. When I walked in, I walked in with a willingness that I do have to do anything and to go to any lengths. There's so many simple things that I do that, you know, last night didn't want to go to the meeting. I have, I have a service commitment at that meeting. I had to go to it. The people aspect of that service commitment is it got me to go to the meeting, gives you a reason to show up, gives me a reason to show up which it was a meeting on gratitude, which you can never have too much of that.
Speaker 3 01:08:15 But, but like before going to it, you know, I'm sitting there and I'm running it through my mind about what I'm going to say. Cause I don't want to go. I don't want to go. I was in a bad head space, right? I mean, there's still happens. People have bad fucking days. Shit happens. Life goes on. What ultimately got me to go to the meeting was I don't want to drink again. It was that simple. It was while I don't want to go to this fucking meeting, am I going to drink? If I don't go to this meeting, not to fucking night, but I might tomorrow or I might the day after that, I might need this meeting tonight. You know? And for me it's life or death. Um, because the last time before rewind it to a year and some change before I went into one of the last, the last treatment that I hopefully will ever have to go into, I was, again, I was suicidal. I didn't want to live anymore. And I'm putting a gun to my fucking head of loaded.
Speaker 0 01:09:03 And that's what I'm grateful for. I'm grateful that you are sitting across from me right now, living and breathing and a happy finding a journey in recovery. That's beautiful. I am so glad that you didn't pull the trigger. I'm honored that you're here tonight to tell your story.
Speaker 3 01:09:28 Good. Burp. Not to
Speaker 0 01:09:31 It's okay. Uh, there we go. Yeah, I can do fake burps. All right. Back to serious eyes. Yeah. I'm so grateful. You're here. I'm grateful that you didn't pull the trigger. I'm grateful for you because you helped me stay sober every time I see you, it makes me happy and energized for life and excited to be in recovery. There's something about your eyes. They talk about that a lot, right? There's something about his eyes that made me reinvigorate it in my program. And it's that sparkle. It's that little bit of Genesee qua. I don't know what, but you got it and I hope you keep it. We'll be right back. And Jared is going to talk about some of that.
Speaker 1 01:10:12 Oh, you want a signature card? <inaudible> you want to have a hope off? You're gonna have,
Speaker 0 01:10:25 All right, here we go. We'll see. You can go the longest. That's what she said. You ready?
Speaker 1 01:10:33 <inaudible> smokers.
Speaker 0 01:11:07 Fuck you. He barely beat
Speaker 1 01:11:10 Me. <inaudible> authentic. And keeping authentic. We have to pay credit where credit is due the musical stylings you EDD on today. Spread program to kick us off. You always hear my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my mind madness by muse. And then we got into Jared's ger at the first break. You heard love yours by J Cole and to <inaudible> P O S by Dayla souls. And remember as always be good to yourselves, it is ever so important. I spelled according with no shoes on,
Speaker 5 01:12:14 I am POS I'll be the new generation of slaves in a big Papes off this land corporation, rape from that life. I'm trying to separate, but I guess I'm living dreams because my rent's always a month late product of the East German, black, who kissed the neck of a pretty woman named grace. But he left my life just a little too soon. Didn't see me catch the Doomtree fame. As we go with a little something like this. Look, mom, no protection. Now I got a baby. Pull it by the name of cheek. And I'm just wanting to play the cowboy to Russell in the Dole. When I think of getting better, every passing day, I'm out an early borer plus the fed this all blacks. By the time I catch an app, which is fine, but it's a must to decipher one's girl from the Brown sweet apples that are running on the inside.
Speaker 5 01:12:56 I cherish my fruit sound, but I'm maximized. So my soul, someone wants, I want to see the stars, give them. So my son, when I'm out to all these hard case, kids I'll raise a black fist, but won't say in the face not right. And I don't say because I don't think it's right under one boy, struggle with that full. What happens like, I guess we got our own lives to live, but I'm stressed too. A thing, trying to build a kingdom to rule. And I think to the past sometimes and dag man, it's fast. Y'all kind of acting like a fool, but I've apologized to the price of the back quite headstrong, but I can safely say I've never played a woman with a call McKesson later on. I tried to walk to the right side of the tracks, but I've had a couple of things. Mama cried. She knew the halfs, but I guess Dan, who I am and face the day straight. No, we're not a fit. Get change. Would I be singing.
