Speaker 0 00:00:00 Hey you. Yeah, you, if you or someone you know, is struggling with anything mentioned on today's program, please, please, please, please, please, please email
[email protected]. That's a U T H E N I C K. The
[email protected]. I am available 24 seven three 65 to help in any way that I can. I have resources. I have open ears and open heart and tons of hope. I've been freely given all these things and would love to give them to you. Be good to yourselves and each other. Follow me on Twitter, using the handle at authen, Nick and my dog, Marla on Instagram at DJ Marla dot Jean. During today's program, you will hear a mentioned multiple times the individual expressing their thoughts and opinions do not reflect AA or Alanon as a whole. Please enjoy get some <inaudible>.
Speaker 1 00:01:40 <inaudible> welcome. Welcome. Welcome to the show.
Speaker 0 00:01:51 My name is Nicholas Thomas Fitzsimmons van enable, but most people just call me Nick and with me as always.
Speaker 1 00:01:58 It's my dog, Marla
Speaker 0 00:02:20 That's that's enough. Marla, go back to looking our ease and AMS. Anyway, welcome to the show. This is authentic.
Speaker 1 00:02:27 Where are we
Speaker 0 00:02:32 Here on authentic, where we get authentic? We talk about all things recovery. What do I mean by that? All things recovery. Well, what I mean by that is if you are still living and breathing on this earth, you, yes, you are in recovery from something. As for myself, I am in recovery from alcoholism. I am an alcoholic. I am also a drug addict. I also have an eating disorder, bipolar disorder. I'm a compulsive gambler. Really? The list could go on and on and on and on and unlucky for you. Today's show is not about me. It is about two people. First is my guest, Alex, who is here to share her experience, strength and hope. Second is the one person that Alex is going to help by giving her testimony tonight, because if we help one person on today's show that we've done our job. We want you to know that you are not alone without <inaudible> smash a victim to the show. Alex, please introduce yourself in any way you see fit. My dear.
Speaker 2 00:03:38 Hi, I'm Alex. I am 26 and I'm in recovery from alcoholism. I'm also a drug addict and I'm in recovery from an eating day.
Speaker 0 00:03:47 Thank you so much for being here tonight. It really means a lot to me that people are willing to come on the show and get vulnerable. So thank you so much for being here. I really appreciate it. Let's get right into it. You said you're in recovery from alcoholism, drug addiction and an eating disorder. Let's start from the very beginning. Is that cool with you? Yeah. What was your childhood like growing up? What were your first memories?
Speaker 2 00:04:09 My childhood was pretty normal. I grew up in a suburb. I mean, it wasn't anything special. I had my dad, he was perfectly normal at the time. My mom, and then I also have two siblings. I have a brother and a sister. My mom is an alcoholic. That was interesting. I have a lot of memories of her drinking. You know, all in all was pretty normal. My mom did have some ideas about me that she wanted me to be. I don't know if that makes sense. She wanted me to look a certain way and be a certain way,
Speaker 0 00:04:38 Like the way you dress or your shape, both.
Speaker 2 00:04:41 She wanted me to be blonde and smile.
Speaker 0 00:04:43 What did that feel like to you? What was that doing to Alex as a child?
Speaker 2 00:04:48 It definitely messed with my head and some of that stuff is still with them.
Speaker 0 00:04:51 You said it messed with your head. What did it do to you?
Speaker 2 00:04:54 What it did the most to me is made me feel like I wasn't enough. Like I wasn't good enough. I wasn't pretty enough. I wasn't skinny enough. Those kinds of things.
Speaker 0 00:05:03 Well, and coming from your mom, that's something that a small child can't help, but believe to be true. This is the person that brought them into the world. This is the person that is supposed to be nurturing them and caring for them. And you're being fed. This message of you are not enough. What you look like is not how you're supposed to look. What you weigh is not what you're supposed to weigh. I'm sorry that that's what you had to go through at such an early age. That's fucks kids up. It really does. I'm sorry. You had to go through that. You're welcome. You said your mom was an alcoholic. Was she a practicing alcoholic at the time? What did that look like for you? What did you witness? What did you recognize about her and her behavior?
Speaker 2 00:05:49 For me drinking was I guess, normal with her. It wasn't anything cause she did it or she's done it my whole life. She would drink every single night. She still does her bottle of wine. I do have a memory of her when I was very small. My dad used to have a truck and it had just like one bench seat. I remember she was leaning on my shoulder after my dad had picked her up one night and she actually threw up on me. So that's one of my first memories
Speaker 0 00:06:15 Of your first memories of your mom. Is she blew chunks on you? Yes. What did she had for dinner? Do you remember?
Speaker 2 00:06:22 No. It just smelled like wine.
Speaker 0 00:06:25 Hey, if that isn't a recipe for making an alcoholic, I'm not quite sure. What is, what were your other memories of your mom as an alcoholic or maybe even more importantly? How was she showing up as a mom?
Speaker 2 00:06:39 I do love my mom and she does have good qualities. She did love me. It wasn't all negative. I have an okay. Relationship with her now. Yeah. I just remember her getting too drunk and I, I don't know, just getting too drunk or if that makes sense, but it was normal to me. Oh, it makes total sense. Yeah. When did you start drinking? I did not start drinking until I was probably 15 or 16, but it was pretty normal. It was just like, I grew up kind of in the country. So it was like around a bonfire. You know what I mean?
Speaker 0 00:07:09 That's how I got my start out in the country. Do you remember your first alcoholic beverage?
Speaker 2 00:07:15 My first alcoholic beverage ever. I was very small and I drank half of my mom's pina colada. Cause it was a smoothie and it looked good and I threw it up
Speaker 0 00:07:25 Very small. Meaning how old are they? Like five or six, five or six? Mm, the smoothie that wasn't really as smooth,
Speaker 2 00:07:35 But my first like alcoholic beverage was, um, sour, Apple pucker. I don't know. You know, at that age my neighbor had actually gotten it for me. He was older and um, we were drinking out in my front yard and I drank so much of it that I threw it up.
Speaker 0 00:07:52 Did you ask him to buy alcohol for you? Yes. Why?
Speaker 2 00:07:55 I don't know why, because we're 16. We're supposed to be drinking in my head. I don't know.
Speaker 0 00:07:59 Was that your thought process were, you know, other kids around you drinking and that's what you wanted to do or was it, Oh, that's what my mom does every night. I want to see what that's all about. What, what do you think was behind that? And there may be nothing behind them. Maybe you just wanted to drink. What do you think
Speaker 2 00:08:15 At that time? I, you know, I was just with my friends and I was just like, yeah, let's get drunk. It's the cool thing to do.
Speaker 0 00:08:20 When did you notice that you really liked alcohol when it wasn't just something to do something to be a part of? When did you notice that it started to be a thing for you?
Speaker 2 00:08:35 So for me, my alcoholism was kind of, um, isn't that an interesting plot line for it? I was a pretty like normal OK. Drinker when I was in high school. Like I could just have like a beer. I can just have a Natty light with my friends, but yeah.
Speaker 0 00:08:50 Nice, good.
Speaker 2 00:08:53 Yes, that me, but, um, my whole experience with chemical dependency and alcoholism didn't start until I was about 18. Right after I had graduated from high school. My mom had convinced me and you know, I could have said no, but it there's a lot of like mental abuse or something that went into me deciding to get gastric bypass at the age of 18. Um, right when I graduated
Speaker 0 00:09:25 High school, what did that mental abuse look like and feel like, I know you talked about earlier that you had this impression from your mom that you were not good enough. You didn't look a certain way. I want to know. Do you remember things that she would actually say to you?
Speaker 2 00:09:41 She'd never actually directly say anything to me. She was very passive aggressive. And so, um, if I was like eating too much, she'd be like, do you really need to have that? Or like, if I came down for a snack, she's like, you don't need a snack. Um, how did that make you feel? I mean, it made me feel really shitty. And I do remember, you know, like going to stores and having, I've always been like a bigger girl. So I remember going to stores and you know, not fitting in the clothes that she would want me to fit in and having to go to different sections to get it.
Speaker 0 00:10:12 What'd you go so far as to say that she was shaming you?
Speaker 2 00:10:16 Yeah, for sure. But I don't think that she did it on purpose.
Speaker 0 00:10:21 No one does these malicious things on purpose. There's always a reason behind them. You know, something that happened in their childhood or something that happened in their adulthood, where they have this idea in their head, that this is how they need to raise their child. This is how they need to relate to the outside world. I have come to this place and it's really, really hard to say it it's very similar to something you would hear in the Bible where it's forgive them for. They know not what they do. I have my own little twist on that. It's forgive them for, they know not what they do otherwise. They wouldn't have done it in the fucking first place. I find truth in that, unless you're a psychopath, nobody really does that shit on purpose. Do you have a guess as to why she was putting that on you?
Speaker 2 00:11:12 I do. I've thought about this stuff a lot, you know, over my recovery from whatever, you know, my grandma was the same way with her. It's not that I understand. And I think it's okay that she did it, but I kind of have an idea as to why.
Speaker 0 00:11:25 And just like chemical dependency, alcoholism, drug addiction, I mean, fill in the blank. Any compulsive behavior. A lot of times it's a family affair. It takes a lot of work. Like the work that you've done over the past four years, by the way, Alex, how long have you been sober? Four years. Four years in how many days? Because you just recently had an anniversary dinner.
Speaker 2 00:11:48 Yes. On July 5th. I was four years,
Speaker 0 00:11:51 July 5th. So today is the first sir, ladies and gentlemen. She has been sober four years, 15 days, 20, 21 hours and 11 minutes. Yay. No, honestly all joking aside and all mental math aside. Congratulations. Thank you. That is so huge. It's so important. So many people don't get help. And what I was driving at earlier, what I was kind of alluding to was this is a family affair, these compulsive behaviors, whether or not you realize it. And it takes a certain person, it takes a person to say, Hey, this needs to stop because I can't continue this cycle. I've seen what it has done to my mom. I've seen obviously what it has done to me enough is enough. I need to stop this. And that's so amazing. And just again, congratulations for stopping the cycle. Thank you. You're welcome. Before we get to stopping the cycle, you said that drugs were also a part of your story. When did drugs make their entrance?
Speaker 2 00:12:59 Drugs kind of came into my life like right after I'd had the surgery. I was prescribed pain medication because I had surgery. I don't remember a lot from like being in the hospital or anything, but I remember the first time that I ever took my favorite drug of choice. I had it at home. I remember just like not taking it cause I was like, I don't need it. It's fine. But then I took a couple of them. I don't know why. And I remember just like taking it and then laying in my bed and just like feeling high and knowing like, that was the answer to all my problems ever. Everything just kind of like disappeared.
Speaker 0 00:13:35 The answer to your problems was not gastric bypass surgery. It was pain medication. Interesting. What were your thoughts going into that surgery about your body?
Speaker 2 00:13:50 My thoughts about my body. I mean, I've always had very negative thoughts about my body. Right? They're better now in all honesty, I was like, if this will get me skinny and then maybe my mom will love me for me then that's okay. Like I'll do it for her.
Speaker 0 00:14:05 So you got this surgery for her? Yeah. It wasn't for me at all. No, it wasn't so much that you wanted to be skinny. Yeah. When you have a parent, when you have somebody in your life, that's feeding you those messages you can't help. And myself included, I couldn't help. But think if I am skinny, then this will get better. I will feel better. People will like me more. I will be accepted for who I am. If I look a certain way, just like addiction. What I've found is that if you don't get help for yourself, it doesn't work. It's not sustainable. You can't maintain it. It's not enjoyable. It's a resentment riddled space that out of control, you're not doing this for yourself. You're doing it for your mom. You're in rehab. If you will, from your gastric bypass and you find these drugs and you lay on your bed and you have found the answer, the answer to everything. What was it about this pain medication specifically that took away what you were feeling? What is it that you were feeling that you wanted to be gone?
Speaker 2 00:15:18 It was like, my head was finally quiet. I don't know if that makes sense. It makes total sense, but it was like all the voices inside my head were just not there anymore. And it was wonderful.
Speaker 0 00:15:30 What did your drug use look like after that? Did it go out of control right out of the gate? Or was it something that it's like, yeah, I could do that every once in a while, then that was fun. Oh no. I took off running. I wanted that high all the time. Addicts. That's how I know. It's like, Oh my God, I want to feel like this all the time. So I'm going to do that all the time.
Speaker 2 00:15:54 And I did it all the time. I was working at a department store and I found someone that worked there that also liked to do the same drugs as me. So I moved in with her and then we just did drugs.
Speaker 0 00:16:06 Were you being prescribed this medication or were you purchasing
Speaker 2 00:16:10 At first? I was prescribed them, but I was only prescribed like a month of it. So then I was purchasing it also, my dad at the same time had a very similar surgery and he was prescribed the same pain medication. So I would also steal it.
Speaker 0 00:16:25 Yes, I've done the exact same thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Stealing pain medication. There's this thing called doctor shopping where you'd say, Oh, I have this ailment. And you know, I've tried this thing in the past and it really worked for me. For me. It was my back surgery. It led me to taking pain medication. So I would go out and I would go doctor shopping. I would see who would prescribe me what I wanted. And if I didn't like what I heard that I go onto the next guy. Was that any part of your experience or was it always purchasing from someone else?
Speaker 2 00:16:57 I would also go doctor shopping. I remember a couple of years ago I went to the ER and they're like, are you still taking coding? And I was just like, no, cause I'd go in and be like, I have a cough, like, you know, once a month. But otherwise, um, me and my roommate at the time, would you see no procure it got nice. Yeah. I think that's the right word. I think. So that was a very mature, I don't think I pronounced it correctly. Cure procure. I don't know. I'd have to Google.
Speaker 0 00:17:25 I like the way you said it. I don't care if it's a word or not. Okay, good. What did your alcoholism look like? What did your drinking habit look like while you were using drugs?
Speaker 2 00:17:35 So honestly at the time it was mostly just drugs. For me. It was downers and uppers at the same time, weed all the time. I wasn't sober ever. I would drink for sure. But that wasn't the main focus of my addiction.
Speaker 0 00:17:50 You said that these drugs made everything quiet. Did that also quiet your eating disorder or was that always with you? To some extent
Speaker 2 00:18:01 The negative body image has always been with me, but my eating disorder didn't get severe until a little bit later.
Speaker 0 00:18:09 What happened in the meantime? What did your continued drug and alcohol use look like? Were there any consequences for your use or was it just kind of, Hey, here we go. This is a one long party and then I'm going to get sober.
Speaker 2 00:18:22 I mean, it was one long party that lasted, you know, a couple of years, but um, I mean, I didn't have any legal consequences, which I am very grateful for. I did have a lot of personal consequences. I wasn't friends with any of my original friends anymore. I wasn't talking to my family anymore cause I just moved out and I was gone. I'm a runner. So I was just like, bye. So I wasn't talking to them anymore. I turned into this person that I just was not, I think I'm kind of a nice person, but when I'm using drugs, I'm just, I'm an asshole. We've waited to sell drugs as well. And if people did not give me what I wanted, like I, I turned into an asshole. I've done some really stupid shit.
Speaker 0 00:19:03 Can you give me an example?
Speaker 2 00:19:06 I mean, I've gotten in fights with people. Um, I've punched people. There is one time that I did pistol whip, someone
Speaker 0 00:19:11 <inaudible> little. Can you hear her laughing so bubbly and giggly? I can not imagine. Well actually I can't imagine you pistol whipping somebody. That sounds awesome. I was not a good person. Why were you cutting off ties from your old friends and your family? Because I didn't want them to see what I had become. You sure about that? Yeah. You didn't want them to see what you had become. It had nothing to do with what they had put you through.
Speaker 2 00:19:41 I mean, that is a, yeah. That's a possibility as well.
Speaker 0 00:19:44 I mean, I know that was a very, very leading question. I do. The reason that I bring it up though, is I had this idea in my head that, yes, I don't want to talk to old friends and especially, I didn't want to talk to my family because I didn't want them to see what I had become. Absolutely. Without a doubt. Also, I didn't want to talk to them because they had this idea about who I was going to be, who I could be. That was the big thing for me. You have so many gifts, you have so much going for you yet. You do not work up to potential. That was the story in my head. You're not good enough. You're not good enough. Something's wrong with you. Something's wrong with you? I just wanted to say, fuck you. This is who I am now. And I found my solution in drugs and alcohol. Yeah. How long did your drug and alcohol use go on for on a consistent basis? You said that you were using all the time. What did using all the time? Look like, run me through a typical day of using all the time. Did that look like I
Speaker 2 00:20:48 Would just wake up? And the first thing I would do is get high with whatever I had on me or whatever my roommate at the time had on me or her boyfriend who was a drug dealer had on him. So it was just like, wake up, get high, and then just stay high enough for the rest of the day.
Speaker 0 00:21:02 How would you stay high enough for the rest of the day? How long after that initial high, when you woke up, would you have to use it?
Speaker 2 00:21:09 Probably every couple hours. I was very physically, physically addicted. I would also take uppers because I took so many downers that I was unfunctional. So those were opiates, those kinds of things. Those are my favorite. I love the way that they made me feel, but then also take certain uppers. And I was still working at this department store and I would bring uppers with me to work. And I remember running into the bathroom and like doing lines and then I'm going out and being the best worker ever actually got employee of the month, one month while I was using, just because I was so high and on my shit. So that it is,
Speaker 0 00:21:50 We laugh about it because we share in this common peril, in some people are taken back, especially folks that haven't gone through the same experience really don't understand. And this isn't a knock towards people that aren't addicts at all. It's this thing where you share in a common peril as addicts in recovery, we find that laughing at ourselves and these ridiculous things like, Oh my gosh, I took, you know, I just pounded a bunch of opiates before I came to work. And now like I can't stop drooling or like my face doesn't work. It's time to go to the bathroom and do some Coke. It's like, got it. You know, little yin and yang. I mean, it's, you gotta balance it. And it's, it's totally ordinary. When did you notice it? Wasn't so ordinary
Speaker 2 00:22:34 Ignorance was bliss for a really long time. There was a couple situations and a couple places that I woke up that I wasn't very happy about. And I noticed that that was an issue. There were days that I didn't remember. And I was like, Oh, that's not, that's not normal. Is it? But I just normalize it. I had this really weird realization. One morning I woke up and I was laying in bed with my cat. I was just kind of hanging out there and my roommate comes in and she's just got like, she brings me a couple lines of cocaine and she's just like, are you ready to get the stay going? And I was just like, no, I'm not. And for some reason, everything just like clicked in my head that what I had become and who I was was not the person that I wanted to be. And I didn't even recognize myself anymore.
Speaker 0 00:23:18 Who was it that you wanted to be? Because we never, we never really touched on that because we talked about what your mom told you through passive aggressive nature, these subliminal messages of what you should be, who did you want to be
Speaker 2 00:23:34 A decent person that wasn't a drug addict at that time? I mean, I still have no idea who I want to be when I grow up. So
Speaker 0 00:23:39 Neither do I. That's why I'm doing this podcast so I can just prolong whatever it is. Perfect. Yeah. Actually the reason I do this podcast is because it's my purpose right now, my whole view on careers, um, call it spite, call, call, call it what you want to call it. This is my purpose right now. And because of the program that I'm involved in this 12 step program, it teaches me to live for today. So I pose the question to you. Who is it that you want to be today?
Speaker 2 00:24:13 Who do I want to be today? I don't know. I just want to be me. I just want to be like authentically me, you know? And that's just like so important to me right now. And I just want to be happy just for today.
Speaker 0 00:24:24 One of yours is standing in the room with us. Not really. There's nobody in the room except Marla, but a friend of yours is standing in the room. I asked this person to describe what kind of person Alex's what do you think that person would say?
Speaker 2 00:24:39 Oh, I have no idea. I'm probably a little weird.
Speaker 0 00:24:44 Ain't nothing weird about being weird, except for the way that it's spelled.
Speaker 2 00:24:49 I honestly, I don't know how to describe myself as a person. I would have to ask someone, ask me, okay, what do you think of me as a person? Who's who me? Ooh, Alex. Alex.
Speaker 0 00:25:02 Yeah. Alex, as a person, Alex is someone who shows up. Alex is someone who cares, who will look you in the eye. Alex is someone who has this sweetness about her, but she also has this
Speaker 2 00:25:19 Well, SAS possess,
Speaker 0 00:25:21 Likes to express herself in the way that she wants to express herself. She has nobody to please. She just is who she is. That's how I would explain. You know, I kind of like that. I like that too. Just so you know that, you know, that was me saying it, but I believe, I truly believe that was a spiritual moment for me when I get out of my own way and stop trying to impress people with my words, the truth comes out. That was the truth again. So grateful that you're here and so grateful to be your friend.
Speaker 2 00:25:53 Yeah. You've been with me since almost day. One of this where? Years of sobriety.
Speaker 0 00:25:57 Yeah. I mean, you got a couple of months on me. I'm a little jealous, but that's neither here nor there let's not compare ourselves. Speaking of comparing ourselves, where was your eating disorder at during this time? Was it always kind of underneath? Were these messages being pumped in? Did it ever get completely quiet where you didn't even notice it? What did, what did your eating disorder look like during this time?
Speaker 2 00:26:22 I actually was able to get off drugs for awhile.
Speaker 0 00:26:26 When you had that lines of cocaine, come, come to me, come to sobriety moment in your bed with your cat. When was that?
Speaker 2 00:26:36 I think I was 20,
Speaker 0 00:26:39 21. And you are how old? Now? 26. Right? So that was defined as 20. Okay. So that was about six years ago and you've been sober a little over four years. So there's those two years that were missing. Let's get into those two years.
Speaker 2 00:26:54 When I was living with my roommate, she was on court mandated like N a N AA recovery groups. So I would go with her, but I'd go really high. It did give me the idea of these groups and knowing that they were there when I went there and in the middle of my drug use, it was kind of this little voice got in my head. You know, that little voice. That's just like, maybe what you're doing. Maybe you have a problem and maybe you should be here. I'm grateful for her for that because she's the reason that I did find these groups. And that's what actually helped me get off drugs for the first time is I couldn't afford treatment. And I didn't really tell my family what was going on. Um, so I actually detoxed on my own, which was not fun at all. And extremely dangerous. Yes. I do not recommend doing that as a health care professional do not do that. I'm sure I almost died. I do not remember most of it. I just remember like just the pain in the area.
Speaker 0 00:27:53 I love the subtle irony of what you, of what you do for work. So amazing. And what is it you do for work? Alex? I am an EMT. That's how she pays her bills. That is outside of that idea that, Hm there's these people here in these 12 step meetings you were talking about there's there's the seed that was planted, right? You were going to these meetings. Huh? Did anyone in these meetings ever a cost? You Oh yeah, for sure. Being high in the meeting,
Speaker 2 00:28:26 I would not often meetings. I definitely should not have been.
Speaker 0 00:28:29 What did people say to you when you were
Speaker 2 00:28:32 Some people were like, are you high? And I'm like, no. Why would you say that? But I was high. Other people were like, you're in the right place. So it just kind of depended on the person
Speaker 0 00:28:42 You are in the right place. It sounds like you never had anybody shooing you out the door. No, there was never anybody that was like, get the fuck outta here. You're high. You don't belong here. It was, are you high? It was just, you know, it was just an inquisition to the truth. It's like, are you high? And by asking that question, maybe that pushed you a little bit further in the direction of, maybe I have a problem. If this person in this recovery meeting is asking me if I'm hot, maybe they know it's quite possible that they know. And the people told you, you were in the right place. How did that make you feel?
Speaker 2 00:29:25 I was like, fuck them. I don't know what they're talking about. Is that really true? No, in my head I was like, no, I definitely shouldn't be here. And I have an issue, but on the outside I was like, fuck you, dude,
Speaker 0 00:29:36 On the outside, you said, fuck you, dude. When did you stop saying, fuck you, dude.
Speaker 2 00:29:42 I did not until I started going on my own for my own reasons.
Speaker 0 00:29:47 And what were your reasons for going on your own?
Speaker 2 00:29:49 I just knew that if I kept continuing the way that I had been continuing that I was going to die, I didn't really know what to do, but I knew that those rooms were available to me. Just ended up going to one in the middle of the country. I had packed all my stuff and moved back in with my parents all in the same day that I woke up with my cat grabbed my cat, all my shit. And I moved back in with my mom. I was really, really sick obviously for about a week
Speaker 0 00:30:14 Detoxing. You're talking about what did, what did detoxing off of opiates look like for you?
Speaker 2 00:30:20 God, I was throwing up. I was shitting my pants. I was sweating. I was shaking. I told my mom, I had the stomach flu. <inaudible>
Speaker 0 00:30:28 I suppose you could liken the stomach flu to detoxing.
Speaker 2 00:30:33 I'm not quite sure how she believed that, but she did cause I was not. Okay.
Speaker 0 00:30:39 Epic stomach.
Speaker 2 00:30:41 Yeah. It was like, I was hallucinating at that point.
Speaker 0 00:30:44 So that was part of your, your detoxing process. You were actually hallucinating while detoxing.
Speaker 2 00:30:50 Yeah. I don't remember what exactly about, I know that I was seeing some shit
Speaker 0 00:30:54 So scary. What a scary place to be after you were through with your detoxing period. Was there ever an idea that okay, I'm done detoxing. I feel better now I can go use drugs and drink. Normally that's enough of that. Now let's just take one pill today and we'll see how it goes. And maybe I'll have a drink later, maybe a pina colada.
Speaker 2 00:31:19 After I had finished that detoxing, for the most part, I actually took myself to a meeting in the middle of the country and I think it was an all men's meeting, but I went in there anyways, cause I had no idea what I was doing and I just cried the whole hour. These poor guys listened to me and were like patting my back and stuff. So I actually got into the program a little bit. I definitely craved drugs, but I managed to stay sober for probably three months. And then I actually went off to college. That one right over there. That one right over there.
Speaker 0 00:31:54 For those of you joining us from different places in the world, the U of M is right across the river. Augsburg actually. Oh, Hans Berg. You rich bitch.
Speaker 2 00:32:06 Yeah. I know them a lot of money. Yeah. So no, I hadn't managed to like white knuckle it for about three months. And then I went to college and I had this idea in my head after I came so close to death so many times. Oh, Dean was part of my story. Um, could you go into that a little bit? I overdosed on opiates a couple of times
Speaker 0 00:32:30 Just taking too many pills or were you shooting? What did,
Speaker 2 00:32:34 What was that for me? That was taking too many pills.
Speaker 0 00:32:36 Okay. Did you ever get into using intravenous drugs? I did
Speaker 2 00:32:40 Not. He did not know. I have really crappy veins and I still do you lucky duck? I know. Yeah. They're horrible. Did you ever attempt it or where I did attempt it, but no go, no go.
Speaker 0 00:32:51 Perhaps your shitty veins saved your life. Hmm. Interesting. So you would overdose by taking too many pills? Yes. What happened? Can you give me an example of a time that you overdosed on pills? What were the repercussions of that
Speaker 2 00:33:07 One time? I remember just waking up on the floor covered in vomit and I know that my roommate had given me a Narcan. And what is Narcan? Narcan? Is it counteracts the effects of the opioids in your brain? It attaches to it. And helps you wake up and brings your respiratory drive back.
Speaker 0 00:33:22 So it saved your life? Yes, it did. After overdosing. What were your thoughts on using again? Was that whoops, I took too many. Or were you taking too many for a reason?
Speaker 2 00:33:33 I think it was ever my intention to overdose and die, but while I was using it definitely wasn't my intention to live. I don't know if that makes any sense at all. It makes total sense
Speaker 0 00:33:44 That you didn't want to die, but you also didn't want to live. It's a commonplace that people with addictions, compulsive behaviors find themselves because they have no control. No, absolutely no control. And it's this idea that they can't imagine their lives with or without their drug, their alcohol, their behavior, whatever it be. And they wish for the end, but they don't want the end. It's such a weird amoeba type place to be. It's just always shifting like, fuck this. Okay. I'm okay. No, I'm not. Okay. How long after these overdoses were you using again, you wake up with vomit all over yourself. Your roommate had given you Narcan to basically resuscitate you to counteract the effects of opioids in your brain. How long after were you using again? I don't know, like an hour later. An hour later. Yeah. Why? Because I had to, what do you mean you have to?
Speaker 2 00:34:44 Because I was so physically dependent at the moment that I had to constantly be on some sort of camera.
Speaker 0 00:34:51 Cool. Where you going through these same detoxing symptoms that you talked about when you got off of drugs, would that happen in the immediate nature? You would start,
Speaker 2 00:35:01 Oh, I'd start to withdrawal probably within an hour of two of not being on it. Don't be it.
Speaker 0 00:35:06 How long did that last for this continuous high? Two years. Two years. How much money do you think you spent in two years on?
Speaker 2 00:35:17 I have no idea. And I do not want to know. I do know that I did make an amend to my mom because I had figured out my dad's a pin code in his bank, his Wells Fargo account. And I was still connected to their account for some reason. And I was able to transfer money directly from his account into my account. How much money did you take overall? Probably like 12,000,
Speaker 0 00:35:41 $12,000. And that all occurred in that two year span? Yes. So a lot more than $12,000 is what you're saying? Yes.
Speaker 2 00:35:50 I mean, I had a job that all went to drugs. We would sell drugs to make money, to buy drugs. You know, I was also a woman, so I could do certain things for sure.
Speaker 0 00:35:59 Is that something you care to talk about or is that something you don't want to talk about?
Speaker 2 00:36:03 I mean, I guess I could talk about it. I mean,
Speaker 0 00:36:05 If you're comfortable talking about it, I think that you telling that would help someone that has gone through the same thing. Yeah. That's, that's really why we're here. It's not because I want to know your deep dark secrets. It's the more vulnerable that I get as a human being, the better chance I have at helping someone. And that's really what I've been taught is I have to be a maximum service to other people so I can stay alive. It's that silly paradox that exists that I used to resist with all of my beings. Fuck you. This is a bunch of hypocrisy. What were the things that you would do to get your drug, to keep using your drug?
Speaker 2 00:36:44 I mean, at that point I would do anything to get high and I would do anything to get my drugs. I did trade sexual favors. I don't know how to put it without sounding weird. I mean, I would have sex with people so I could get my drugs.
Speaker 0 00:36:57 You would trade sex for drugs. How much drugs would you get for having sex with him?
Speaker 2 00:37:02 It depended on the person, but as long as I got drugs, I was fine.
Speaker 0 00:37:05 Just use for example, one, one time you have sex with somebody, they give you drugs. How long would those drugs last that you just had sex with someone for not very long, less than a day? Probably. Yeah. Such a hard place to be, to be unable. And that's the thing about addiction is just this inability to discern, not being able to live without their drug living to get high and getting high to live. What a terrifying place to be. Yeah. And I'm sorry that you had to go through that in order to feed this awful thing called addiction. We are not our addiction. And I'm so glad that you shared that. So many people that have engaged in that. Never talk about it. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no one can ever fucking know that I traded sexual favors for drugs. Hell no. I'm going to take that shit to the grave by you telling that story. There's that one woman or man out there that can take solace in there is help. And there is four years, 15 days and 20 hours and 44 minutes of recovery available.
Speaker 2 00:38:19 Yeah. That still blows my fucking mind. So it's possible.
Speaker 0 00:38:23 It's possible. This is where I'm at right now. And this is where she's at and she was doing the same shit I was truly, to me is the most beautiful thing is this transformation of a person that we do not, it's not even a person. It's just this entity, this empty shell that we do not even recognize today. That was who we quote unquote were.
Speaker 2 00:38:50 Yeah. So knowing that history, I was on shift one day and I was sitting in a fire station and I was sitting in a chair sandwich between a police chief and a police officer and then a bunch of fire guys. And here's me being an EMT. And I was just like, I started laughing cause I was just like, what the fuck. If you looked at me six years ago, and now here I'm like sitting with all these people. And I just started laughing and my partner was like, what are you doing? And I'm like, you don't understand how crazy this is right now, man.
Speaker 0 00:39:29 It is possible. It is possible. And you are living proof. How long did you continue to use before you got sober? This last,
Speaker 2 00:39:40 After I had gone to college. If you go back to that school over there. Perfect. Got it. Yes. I'm still owe them a lot of money. Sorry guys. Student loans went to college and I was like, yeah, I can stay sober and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But then I had this idea in my head that I didn't have a problem with alcohol. I just had a problem with drugs so I could drink. Cause that makes total sense. So I started to drink and I was just drunk for all of college. Well, not all of college. I don't know. Probably a year of college. I was just drunk.
Speaker 0 00:40:14 Would you say it was a seamless replacement?
Speaker 2 00:40:18 I don't know if it was seamless. I like to switch addictions. Yeah. Yeah. You know me drinking. It did take the place of doing those drugs. I felt comfortable being drunk all the time.
Speaker 0 00:40:31 How loud was your eating disorder at this time?
Speaker 2 00:40:33 I try it a couple times to get sober off of drinking while I was still at Augsburg because Augsburg has a sober community program. I remember one time I had gone to a rave in EDM show and there actually a couple sober guys there and I was really, really drunk and my roommate was like, Oh, I need to get her home. And so I ended up getting in a car with them being really drunk. I think I actually may have like thrown up somewhere near them. And then a couple of days later I had gone to a meeting. Um, and they were there and they were just like, glad you're here. We're so glad you made it. Yeah, we knew you were one of them. I mean, it was pretty obvious. I mean, I should have known right away, but I didn't really care. So
Speaker 0 00:41:18 Right. Eating disorder. Where was it at? During, during this drinking?
Speaker 2 00:41:24 It was actually more quiet when I used it. Wasn't something that was in my head. Like I have depression and anxiety, like every other fucking American in the world. And
Speaker 0 00:41:36 One medication for your mental health? I am. Okay. Antidepressants, antianxiety. What do you care to disclose what you're on?
Speaker 2 00:41:43 No, it's fine. I take a antidepressant, which I have been on for a very long time. And I also take, it's like a non-addictive sedative kind of at night. Cause I'm also an insomniac that doesn't sleep. So, and that also helps with things. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:41:57 Do those medications work if you're drinking or getting high? No, because you have to take them. I always find that necessary to point out because it is a fact. If you are taking mental health medication, it does not work in its intended way. If you are using alcohol or drugs, it just does not work the intended way.
Speaker 2 00:42:24 It also can make the stuff that you're doing a lot stronger. If you're not careful.
Speaker 0 00:42:29 When did you start taking mental health medication? And
Speaker 2 00:42:32 I was 10. 10. Yeah. <inaudible>
Speaker 0 00:42:37 What did that, what did that look like?
Speaker 2 00:42:39 I've actually been on the same medication since I was little, well, higher dose now just cause I'm an adult. You know, I had a lot of anger issues as a kid. I remember throwing things. My mom took me to the doctor. I was never like suicidal or anything like that. I think they definitely had depression. I do remember feeling sad. So I ended up getting on these antidepressants and they did help
Speaker 0 00:43:01 You have this underlying sadness all the time. Yes. Did that make you high when you took these mental health meds, what did that do for you as a kid?
Speaker 2 00:43:10 What it do for me at the time I was just on the antidepressant and I was on a very,
Speaker 0 00:43:15 What did you notice that those antidepressants did for you is, is really what I'm asking?
Speaker 2 00:43:19 I think that they helped, they made me feel less sad. I honestly don't remember.
Speaker 0 00:43:24 And what do your mental health meds do for you now?
Speaker 2 00:43:27 For me, they do help me and they do help stabilize me. I am a firm believer that it's okay to take medications. If you have mental health, I know that everyone has their own opinion. I'm not on so many medications that I don't feel or anything like that, or I'm numb, but I'm on like a really good balance of medications that help me stay less depressed and anxious.
Speaker 0 00:43:50 Well, and that's really what you were looking for. Right? You were looking for some sense of quote unquote normalcy. Yeah. Finally it was explained or express to you that it's okay. Some people just feel sad all the time. It's called depression. If you tell someone with depression, just cheer up or let's go do some jumping jacks, you need some endorphins, uh, that may help a little, but that is not the problem. The problem is a chemical imbalance in the brain. And these mental health medications can help people to normalize that. I take mental health medication. There are so many, there are millions of people in the world that take mental health medication just to even out. And what I've noticed when I don't take my mental health medication, what it basically looks like is these extreme peaks and these very Lou valleys and what mental health medication does for me. Like you said, it doesn't numb me out. It gets me in this place in between where there's rolling Hills. It's not extreme highs and extreme lows. It's these rolling Hills where life is happening. Yes. Sometimes I'm going to be set. Yes. Sometimes I'm going to be ecstatic, but it's not that extreme.
Speaker 2 00:45:06 Yeah. I'm not going to heat off a bridge, but
Speaker 0 00:45:09 Right. Nice. Yeah. Nice bridges are weird. How do you feel about bridges
Speaker 2 00:45:15 In general? Yeah. I don't know. I think bridges are pretty like driving over them. Okay. Metal or stone, metal, wood, wood, or stone. What is scary? I feel like, I feel like metal is more secure.
Speaker 0 00:45:32 Do you feel secure when you're around me? So you've been taking mental health medication for more than half of your life and now you are a clean and sober. So it is working in its intended way. Yeah. Are there times where you need to change your mental? You said you've been on the same mental health medication since you were a child, but you also said you were on a different dose. Does that change from time to time?
Speaker 2 00:46:06 Well, I mean, as an adult, you obviously need more medication cause you're bigger human and I've tried other medications. I don't know why or remember why, but I've definitely tried other medications, but this is the one that like works and keeps me the happiest. I mean, I still have really crappy days. You know what I mean? Maybe I'll have like three or four depressed days a month, but that's, you know, a hell of a lot better than feeling that way every single day.
Speaker 0 00:46:29 And I think that's just called life. Yeah. Yeah. Three or four depressed days out of 30 is pretty damn good. And I think that's just called normal trying these other mental health medications. I find it. I think it's very important that you mentioned that there isn't one panacea there isn't this one pill cure all. There are other mental health medications out there. If one doesn't work for you, please, if you are seeking this help, if you are trying mental health medications, if one doesn't work for you, try another one. If that doesn't work for you, try another one. There are so many things out there that can be tailored specifically to your brain chemistry, whether it's the dosage or the actual chemical makeup of the drug, please, I encourage you. If you are seeking mental health help and medication is suggested. If at first you don't succeed. Try, try, try again, please, please, please. It's been my experience that I had to go through multiple dosages and different meds in order to find something that worked for me enough about mental health medications. Yeah. Ooh, that was, that was quite the tangent. Get off your fucking high horse.
Speaker 0 00:47:46 We're going to go back to your last two years of use. Yes. We're going to go back there. I'd like you to give me a little lead up to the moment of your last day of use. What did those last few days look like for you? The last time I used was actually relapsed
Speaker 2 00:48:05 Relapse is part of my story. I would try to get sober and then I would start going to meetings. And then I would usually just fall off the horse. I could get like a couple months sober, but then I'd just go and do it.
Speaker 0 00:48:20 Why do you think that is? I don't know.
Speaker 2 00:48:22 Cunning, baffling and powerful.
Speaker 0 00:48:24 Oh, she likes quoting stuff. That's true there there's there's this line in a basic text in a 12 step program that says the nature of this addiction, the nature of this chemical is cunning, baffling and powerful. It's really this mental aspect that exists in addiction. It's not just the physical addiction. It's both in my experience for me. The mental piece was just as important or just as pertinent. If not more than the physical piece, you kept relapsing, you would get a couple months clean and sober. You were going to these meetings. What did that lead up to? What was the catalyst moment that got you to where you are right now?
Speaker 2 00:49:09 And so my sobriety date is July 5th, 2016. Nailed it. I just was on family vacation and I just got shit faced again. At that time, my father was still alive and he was drinking. He also was a drug addict and turn into an alcoholic just like me. I was currently at the time watching him die. I just didn't want to do that to my family. I guess I didn't want, it was also so scary to watch.
Speaker 0 00:49:38 You didn't want to do to your family, what your dad was doing to your face?
Speaker 2 00:49:42 Yes. I didn't want to add onto it, I guess. And I didn't want that to happen to me the way that my, the way that my dad was dying was very scary to see. And I knew that if I continued the path that I was on and drinking that way, that I could definitely turn into my dad
Speaker 0 00:49:59 At that point. Okay. So what did you do
Speaker 2 00:50:02 Relapsed? I woke up on July 5th. I texted people I knew from the program and I went okay.
Speaker 0 00:50:08 And that was the last time you had a drink or a drug? Yes. You're woke up and you called somebody and you went to a meeting. You didn't go to a 28 day inpatient program. You didn't do any of that. You just called someone and went to a meeting. And that was the last day that you had a drinker. A truck. Yes. Well, I'm so glad that on July 5th, 2016, you made that decision to pick up that 500 pound phone, call a friend and seek a solution. We are going to take a little break here. And when we come back, we are going to discuss how Alex got some Oh, and found some stress. We'll be right back. All right, kiddos, that's it for part one. Yay. Stay tuned next week where you will hear Alex Kay. Share her strength and her hope always here on authentic and keeping authentic. We have to pay credit where credit is due, the musical stylings. You add on today's program to open the show as always. You hear my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my mind madness, my muse. And to take us off into the night sky or the days Ray hallucinogenics by Matt Mason.
Speaker 4 00:51:59 <inaudible>, <inaudible>
Speaker 5 00:53:48 That carried on like the way.
